Tag: natural gas

Inflation 2.0, Bullish Metals & Oil, and Russian Supply Caps Discussed

Post author By admin
Post date February 11, 2023

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The Week Ahead with Tony Nash brings together experts Tony Greer, Albert Marko, and Tracy Shuchart to discuss the key themes affecting the markets. In this episode, the focus is on Inflation 2.0, Market Chaos, and Russian Supply Caps.

Albert Marko leads the discussion on Inflation 2.0, and explains his view that inflation will re-accelerate this year. He talks about how various factors such as the Federal Reserve, a potential recession or slowdown, and war could impact his thesis. He also mentions the upward revision of December Consumer Price Index (CPI) and the upcoming release of the January CPI.

Tony Greer then takes the lead on Market Chaos and explains why he is bullish on metals and oil. He discusses his views on copper and explains his outlook on crude oil, which he tweeted about in January.

Tracy Shuchart focuses on Energy and the Russian supply caps. She talks about Russia’s announcement to cut production to 500k barrels per day and what this could mean for crude quotas and price caps. She also discusses the impact on natural gas.

Finally, the experts provide their expectations for the Week Ahead.

Key themes
1. Inflation 2.0
2. Market Chaos: Bullish Metals & Oil
3. Russian Supply Caps

This is the 52nd episode of The Week Ahead, where experts talk about the week that just happened and what will most likely happen in the coming week.

Follow The Week Ahead panel on Twitter:
Tony: https://twitter.com/TonyNashNerd
Albert: https://twitter.com/amlivemon
Tracy: https://twitter.com/chigrl
Tony Greer: https://twitter.com/TgMacro

Listen to this episode on Spotify.

You can also listen on Apple Podcast using this link.

Transcript

Tony Nash

Hi, everyone, and welcome to the Week Ahead. I’m Tony Nash. And today we’re joined by Tony Greer. Tony is with TG macro. He does the morning navigator newsletter. He’s an OG with RealVision and he’s just very, very popular and we’re really lucky to have him today. We have Albert Marko, of course and Tracy Shuchart. We’re very fortunate to have both of them today. So thanks guys, for taking the time to talk with us today. I really appreciate it.

Tony Greer

My pleasure. Thanks for asking.

Tony Nash

Great. So we’re going to start today with Albert. We’re going to be talking about inflation. Albert, you’ve said several times over the past several months that we’re going to have kind of a re-acceleration of inflation this year. And we just had an upward revision of the December CPI. And of course, we have another CPI, the Jan CPI is out on Tuesday. There was a viewer question talking about kind of your Inflation 2.0 thesis.

Can you talk us through that? What are you thinking of when you think through that and when do you think it’ll materialize?

Albert

I’m looking at multiple variables at the moment. Russia probably reactivating some of the military operations in Ukraine, which I think we started to see the last couple of days a little bit. We have China reopening. The Europeans have been in a zombie state, so they’re technically reopening, so their demand is coming back. All that’s going to be inflationary, in my opinion. But the biggest factor that I see has been Yellen’s use of the TGA to offset QT.

Tony Nash

What’s the TGA?

Albert

Well, the treasury general account. So she has a big slush fund of money where she can place wherever she wants. And what that’s been doing has been helping rally the markets purely out of political reasons. And when you have a net zero quantitative tightening cycle, it’s like, what do they expect that to happen at the moment?

Tony Nash

Let me back up just for people who aren’t… So we had a Fed meeting last week. They raised by 25, they’re continuing QT incrementally. Right. And so what you’re saying is that Yellen is offsetting that QT with spending from the TGA?

Albert

Yeah, it’s exactly what I’ve been saying. I’ve been at this for quite a long time. She’s gone hog wild on the treasury bills in the recent months and that’s pretty much the reason we got a stock rally. You’re looking at the duration of liquidity, which is very, very important and nobody really wants to talk about that at the moment. So I mean, these stock rallies have gives a perception of a solid market and overall economy aiming to help the Biden administration for purely political reasons. Right. And this revision, yeah, it was revised and people think it’s an incremental revision, but it’s a 33% rise and CPI from the for the previous data, so it’s not incremental whatsoever.

Tony Nash

Yeah, month on month it’s, it’s a little bit elusive for people to understand how big of a revision this is. Whenever economic data come out, anybody who follows me knows I always say wait for the revision. Right. Especially with OECD countries, wait for the revision because they hide stuff and they leak it out in previous data, other things. And so, as you just said, Albert, there was a 33% revision in the December CPI. That’s massive, right?

Albert

Yeah. Wage inflation is spiraling out of control. We have not just the United States, but now you have the Bank of Japan reporting more inflation from their side. In fact, the Australians did the same thing. They’re having hot CPI numbers. I mean, if we have a hot CPI number coming Tuesday, I mean, it’s just not going to be pretty for equities, in my opinion. And I think that’s why Jerome Powell would soft last week, just because he sees the data and he knows what’s coming.

Tony Nash

So what is a hot CPI number to you?

Albert

I think anything above what the consensus is, whether it’s even 0.1 or .2, anything that’s sticky in the core CPI is going to be hot.

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Tony Nash

Tony, you’re wincing there. Why do you do that?

Tony Greer

No, I mean, I was hoping for a specific magnitude, you know what I mean? As a trader, I’m like, how much higher is he expecting? And he was anything higher and I was like, 8%, 9%, 10%, what do we like? That’s all. I’m very interested. I think he’s on the absolute right track.

Albert

It’s hard because the VLS has been using different calculations and methodologies to calculate CPI. They just changed the way they weigh it, so they’re trying to keep it within a reasonable amount. But when you’re looking at fertilizers and fertilizer companies like Mosaic, and then you have nat gas spiking and then wheat spiking today, either that’s Russia ramping up military affairs in Ukraine, or there’s a hot CPI number coming, my opinion, or both.

Tony Nash

Okay. How much of a factor is like the earthquake in Turkey? Or is any of that a factor?

Albert

That’s a huge factor, Tony, because that’s going to start cutting off, that’s going to start up cutting oil supply, and that’s one of the prime components of inflation. And I’ll let Tracy get onto the details of that. But that’s one in many variables that we’re going to start looking at.

Tony Nash

Okay, when you say inflation 2.0 is coming, are you looking at say, Q2 or something when that will kind of reemerge or what’s your timing on that?

Albert

I’m thinking Q2 at this point. Originally I thought it would be in September or October, but I think the timeline definitely come faster.

Tony Nash

Okay, so what’s driving that is largely kind of energy and ag? Is that..

Albert

Energy, ag, and specifically just the market just being just rallying relentlessly, it just won’t go down. And that’s spurring commodities. Copper, oil, you name it, wheat, grains, everything.

Tony Nash

Okay, if I understand you correctly, just to reiterate what you said. We have more money going into the money supply because of the spending from the TGA that’s offsetting QT. And that money in the money supply is going to people who are driving up commodity prices, driving up equity markets, and potentially driving up real estate. Right. Because we saw some real estate numbers this past week that were not discouraging. Right. I mean, real estate isn’t dying like many people thought right now. And mortgage rates are generally kind of going down. So it seems like we have money going into those things, which is kind of the opposite of what the Feds here are trying to achieve.

Albert

Yeah, the mortgage rate ticks down just a little bit and all of a sudden the spurs on buying. So everything that the Fed has been trying to do is just not happening. Labor, housing, stocks, everything, literally everything.

Tony Nash

Okay, and so how much longer can Yellen use the TGA, does she have unlimited capacity there?

Albert

No, she doesn’t. And Congress can definitely put on oversight on that. But she started off in… Well started off, but she had about 160 billion per month just prior to the midterms. But now she’s down to about 50, 60. Yeah, but that’ll get replenished in April when the tax money comes in for the use.

Tony Nash

Okay, so it will be muted in Feb-March. But she can go guns blazing again in April.

Albert

And this is part of the negotiations with the budget, with the Republicans and the Democrats is trying to limit what she can do with the TGA at the moment. They won’t say it publicly, but they’re certainly trying to.

Tony Nash

Okay, very interesting. Okay, so for those of you guys out there, check out the treasury general account and just see what’s out there, I think that would be really interesting to look into. Okay. Anything else on this, Albert? Is inflation 2.0? Is it going to hit the US or hit, say, Europe or Asia or where do you think?

Albert

I think Asia and Australia is up first for inflation and then leaking over the United States. Obviously I don’t think we’re going to see 9.9 prints on the CPI, but steady 6-7. We definitely see that.

Tony Nash

Okay, great. All right. And then do you think that tapers off in say, Q4 or something like that?

Albert

I think so. I think it’ll start tapering off again. I think it’s going to be in a cycle.

Tony Nash

Okay, great. All right, so we just put out our I just tweeted out our Complete Intelligence CPI print expectations for the year and we think on average we’re going to be about 5.3% for the year. So we’re probably a little bit below your expectations. All right, Albert, thanks very much. I really appreciate that.

Albert

Thanks.

Tony Nash

Tony, let’s move on to you. When we spoke before this discussion, you talked about market chaos like you enjoy it. Are you having fun with this?

Tony Greer

Yeah, I am. This is the kind of trading that benefits, a more active trader, I think, like me, and somebody that’s not afraid to get flat things and take advantage of what looked like absurd price opportunities in the immediate term and things like that. So, yeah, I’m having a good time with this, Tony. I really am.

Tony Nash

That’s great. Can you talk us through kind of… You seem to indicate that you’re pretty bullish on metals and oil, so can you help us through that? And let’s look at metals first. I’ve got a chart for copper up and that price has obviously come down recently. But why are you so bullish on metal? Is copper included?

Tony Greer

Yeah. So let’s go right into it, Tony. The copper is definitely included. What got me so bullish was last year, I remember spending the whole entire second half of 2022 watching copper pound 6500 on the LME. Right? And for me, that equates to the 2017 and 2018 peak in copper, from which point it failed and faded lower and then traded down below 5k during the lockdown. So we saw the big spike to 11k, where everybody thought copper was going to the moon.

Tony Greer

All of that was essentially the lead in to the Biden Administration. That was the lead into the Biden administration. The pivot to electronic vehicle was that big copper rally to 11k and it consolidated there for the entirety of 2021. Then in 2022, copper backed off and pounded the highs from 2018 at 6500, held, and got back up above its moving averages. So when you see that and it coincides with another fairly tight physical market, another backward dated commodity, another commodity where inventories are nosediving, so you’ve got the supply side really on your side. The sort of argument against that is that China is storing and taking a lot of copper off of inventory.

Tony Greer

And my response to that is if they’re taking it off inventory, they’re probably not going to sell it anytime soon, so I don’t have to worry about it. That’s kind of the sort of one basic slant of my metal bullishness, right?

Tony Greer

And the other side of it I have in my mind, I’m fairly convinced that the dollar is going to be on a path lower this year. If you notice last year, she peaked at the Bank of England intervention when the guilt market came apart, and then she formed a lower high when Dollar-Yen got to 150 and the Bank of Japan showed up and said, “hold on, hold on, hold on. You guys kill it.” You know what I mean? That was an absolutely inexplicable FX rally that people haven’t seen in decades.

Tony Greer

So with those two central banks at the top, Tony, a curl down below the moving averages, and coincidentally, with the backdrop of two stories, number one, central bank digital currency story seems to be gaining traction. Whether we like it or not, whether it’s good for us or not, I feel like we’re going to have those and that’s going to detract from the purchasing power of the dollar again.

Tony Greer

And then you’ve got the story where it seems like Russia, Saudi Arabia, China, the rest of the BRICS are very interested in starting their own commodity markets, priced in their own currencies.

Tony Nash

Don’t get Albert started on that.

Tony Greer

Yeah, exactly. I was going to say, I don’t know if that’s a fair topic for discussion and maybe he may be a perma petrol dollar and that’s fair too. I don’t know. But I see that as a story, as sort of deteriorating credibility in the dollar, certainly. And that’s just the way I’m leaning. And it’s not something my money is where my mouth is. The dollar for me is a barometer that tells me how much wind am I going to have in my commodity sales. So I do not have any risk on in the dollar.

Tony Nash

Okay, we should actually come back and talk about that at some point in detail. Sorry, Tracy. You were saying?

Tracy

I was going to say we should also factor into this conversation the fact that we’ve had the lack of capex in the mining industry as far as the metals are concerned. That is equal to the same lack of capex that we’ve had in, say, the oil industry. So that definitely factors into the situation as well when you’re trying to transition to EVs, EV charging stations and all of these metals, even windmills as far as copper is concerned, et cetera. The mining industry again, I don’t know how you feel about that, but I just want to kind of throw that in there.

Tony Greer

Couldn’t agree more.

Albert

The only thing I have to say about the dollar moved down and up is I do agree with Tony that I think the dollar will probably go down a little bit, probably 97, 98. Right. But unfortunately, if inflation comes back, they’re going to have to use the dollar to kick it in the rear so we could see a 97-96 and then go right back up to 105 as they try to fight inflation again. It’s certainly possible. This is going to be a topsy turvy of a year no matter which way you look at it, whether it’s going to be dollar up, dollar down, commodities up, down. It’s just going to be all about the Fed and what intervention they do with inflation.

Tony Greer

It’s nonlinear chaos. Right. The curve.

Tracy

Yeah.

Albert

But this is great for a trader, for a trading. You want to see volatility.

Tony Nash

Very good. Okay, Tony, let’s let’s move into oil then. You’re also seem to be very bullish crude and and we have a tweet from you from Jan. 17 talking about crude going through its 50 day moving average and so on and so forth, talking about some serious muscle in crude markets. So can you talk us through that as well?

Tony Greer

Yeah, so that’s strictly a technical look. And to me, oil continues to make bottom formations and fail. Right? That’s what it keeps doing. We keep seeing an inverted head and shoulders, and then it kinda break the moving averages, and then we see another inverted head and shoulders. That’s even shallower than the last one because they can’t pound it any lower, and that can’t break the moving averages and we back off. And now we’ve got another situation where we’ve got another pattern that’s extremely bullish, where we just had the recent low fall between the last two lows, Tony.

Tony Greer

And that’s a little bit of tea leaves, but that formation is called a wiggle, and we haven’t traded lower since we put in that low. That was between those two lows, if you notice. And so now we’re attacking the 100 day moving average. I mean, this could be it. I walked into this year saying technically, I’m not going to miss out on the trade where crude oil goes through the 50 day, the 100 day, the 200 day, and keeps going, right? That’s the trade I’ve got a bullseye on. And if I have to stop myself out of it ten times, I’m going to be in the 11th time, I can guarantee you. So that’s how I’m looking at the world.

Tony Greer

From the supply side, the driver to me has been gasoline demand. Quite honestly, gasoline demand globally is sort of everybody’s concerned about the recession now. Not concerned about recession. I’ve traded through dozens of recessions and I have noticed that many of them don’t put a major dent in gasoline demand. So I feel like we’re set up for that type of move again, where we have steady gasoline demand. We’re able to keep this crack spread elevated at a $30 to $50 level, where they used to be eight to $12. Right. That’s the margin that a refiner makes for splitting barrels of crude into jet fuel and diesel. So with that crack spread and remaining elevated, the rest of the curve remaining backwardated, although that’s another trip that’s going to be non linear and wacky. But with inventories largely diving below five-year average inventories across the board, the demand for diesel, the demand for jet fuel. Demand for diesel was last year. This year, it seems like demand for jet fuel is really coming back quite a bit. So I just see a great supply side story, a fairly good demand side story, and I see resource nationalism everywhere I look, and that’s generally positive for crude oil.

Tony Greer

So when you line all of that up, the stars align with the technical picture. When we do eventually go skipping through those moving averages, the stage is set for it not to come back. I don’t know if that’s going to happen, but as a trader, I’m going to put my chips in that circle and see what happens.

Tony Nash

Sounds very solid. Tracy, I see you agreeing pretty violently. What else do you have to add there?

Tony Greer

Yeah, I want to hear what you’re adding, Tracy.

Tracy

No, I absolutely agree. When we talk about the supply side and the demand side, we really have to take a look at China. And I know we keep talking about the China opening story, but if we do really look at mobility data and I posted a couple of charts on this today, mobility data is up. Right. And then you also have what I think is more important is if you look at flight data and jet fuel demand, which is up once again, because we know that for Chinese New Year, we had a lot of domestic demand increase, but what we’re really looking for is international demand increase. Right. And so we’ve recently seen China flights to Hong Kong increase in full because that flight pattern was shut down. And so I think this is going to be a major forecast, and we have to realize that China has been drawing down on their stocks locally. Right? And so eventually they’re going to have to rebuy on the international market. If they’ve been depending on the stocks that they accrued since they’ve been shut down over the last year, if they’re pulling down those stocks. China is one country that is not the US.

Tracy

Let’s put it that way. They do not want their SPR to go to zero, all right? They really depend on this. And so because they’ve had to draw down on their domestic stocks, I would be looking for them to start buying on the international market again, especially when they’re getting really cheap crude oil right now from Russia. They would start buying.

Tony Nash

When do you think that is?

Tracy

I think now. They are buying now. I’ll post some charts on Twitter again, but according to Bortex data, there is a lot of seaborne crude going to China right now. We know that they get a lot of natural gas domestically through pipeline, and they’re expanding those pipelines, but realistically, crude oil is still seaborne, and so we can track that.

Tony Nash

Okay, interesting.

Albert

Yeah. Tony a lot of people sit there and criticize it like, well, China has been open and they’re not doing anything, and blah, blah, blah. But it’s not a black or white thing with China. I mean, they’re staggering their opening. They’re not dumb, because if they open just full speed ahead, they’d have a commodity inflation issue even worse than the United States would. So they are buying. And I agree with Tony with the oil bull market case, and I agree with Tracy. The supply side demand side is heavy. The Chinese are reopening and buying still. And I think oil goes to minimum 110 this year. Minimum.

Tony Nash

I love it when ours says, I agree with Tony because I’m not used to hearing that. But I know he’s talking about you, Tony Greer.

Tony Greer

That’s fine looking, Tony. Beautiful part. Yeah. The beautiful part about this market, Tone, is that you can find the opposite side of your trade. You just got to open your eyes and ears, right?

Tracy

That’s what you really need to do, because if you have a thesis, you really want to hear the opposite side. Right?

Tony Nash

Tell me about that. What is the downside thesis for oil? What is that downside thesis?

Tony Greer

Drill, baby, drill.

Albert

That’s not politically viable.

Tracy

Which is not going to happen. Which is not going to happen.

Tony Greer

Right. So that’s why you say you can get annoyed at what’s going on or you can make moves in the market, right. You can buy the energy complex and buy oil because that’s the direction it’s naturally going to go if they’re going to try to put this electric vehicle squeeze on by 2030. Right? I mean, that’s almost necessary. And almost the necessary trade is for the Bloomberg Commodity Index to go up 40% from here. If we’re going to fill all these orders to build battery packs and battery power all over the world.

Albert

The only the only other downside for oil is if the government starts playing around in oil futures and trying to sell it down just to keep it relatively safe on the inflation front, which they did.

Tony Greer

It was remarkably effective. It was remarkably effective. What they did with the SPR, you have to say, whether we like it or not, they knocked 30, $40 off the price.

Albert

It wasn’t just the SPR, though. They were sitting there selling down in oil futures in the market.

Tony Greer

They have a president’s working group that’s allowed to do that. I’m sure they are.

Albert

They do.

Tony Nash

Free market capitalism. You got to love it, right?

Albert

Yeah.

Tony Greer

Well, free market, political-driven capital.

Albert

Well, this is what Tony was mentioned this is what Tony was talking about when he said nationalizing commodities and whatnot. Of course they’re inflationary effects, but the governments only care about short term. What’s going to make my voters happy for the next election in six months? That’s all they care about.

Tracy

It’s kick the can theory, right? The Fed does this all the time. We see central banks do this all the time. Why not governments, right?

Tony Nash

Yes. Okay, guys, let’s move on to crude oil, specifically. Tracy, on Friday, we saw Russia announce plans to cut production to 500,000 barrels a day. Brent rose on the news. And I’m really curious. What is Russia producing right now? So are they at that volume capacity? And what does that mean for the crude quota and the price cap?

Tracy

Well, Russia is already producing at their quota according to the OPEC. The thing is, their OPEC quota and I won’t get into the logistics of this, but their OPEC quota is a lot of condensate oil, not straight oil. But aside from those details, we have to go in fact, Russia Euros is trading literally between $40 and $45 right now as we are speaking today on Friday. The the what date is this? I just want to make sure some people the 10 February. And so I think that you have to you know, I think what Russia is trying to do right now is try to bump up the price of oil for themselves, because I think if oil prices are higher for them, even though they are supplying less, they’re going to make more money regardless. I also think that this puts a thorn in the side to the west, because they’re trying to bump up oil prices. When Western nations are trying to push down oil prices. Right. They don’t want to see inflation go higher. And energy is a big part of that, even though central banks don’t realize that. But we have to, you know, it is a big part of the inflation factor.

Tracy

And so what I think they’re trying to do is basically say, I’m going to be a thorn in your side. We’re going to kick up oil prices. I’m also going to benefit myself because oil prices are going to go higher for me. And maybe they reach the cap $60. They’re well below then. You know, they’re still making more money with reduced volumes.

Tony Nash

Okay, so Euro trades at $20 discount, right, at this point.

Tracy

To the price cap.

Tony Nash

Right. But who are they hurting, aside from, say, India and China and a few other countries that are their traditional allies?

Tracy

Well, even if that price went up of your rails, at this juncture, China and India are still getting great deals, right? At $60 a barrel, you’re still getting a great deal. Right. You’re $20, $30 below what Brent and WTI are trading at. And so I don’t think that really matters to them. As far as am I going to lose China and India as customers, I don’t think that’s even a concern of theirs because they realize that their oil is trading well below everybody else.

Tony Nash

So I guess if they’re going to have the same customers, the China India customers generally, why does it matter? Aside from… Why does it matter to Brent that Russia has raised or capped off their production? If it’s going to go to the same markets anyway? I’m just curious. Why does it matter to the non-Euros crude?

Tracy

Because you’re taking barrels off the market, and that is the only thing the market looks at. How many barrels are you taking off the market? If you’re taking 500,000 barrels per day off the market, then these other that’s 500 barrels per day off the market.

Tony Nash

Sorry, what do they have said this before? What are they producing now?

Tracy

They’re at about 10.5, but again, that includes condensate. It’s not exactly 10.5 million barrels of oil per day.

Tony Nash

Okay.

Albert

Basically, how’s the earthquake in Turkey affecting things on the supply side?

Tracy

All right, so if we look at saline ports, we’ve taken 8885 barrels per day off the market as well. Almost a million barrels per day off the market from that specific port. That specific port was supposed to be down for two to three days. That’s looking like a lot longer at this junction.

Tony Nash

Okay.

Tracy

That’s also affecting global markets.

Tony Nash

Okay. So between Russia and the Turkey earthquake, there’s a real impact on markets?

Tracy

Absolutely.

Tony Nash

Okay.

Albert

And of course they’d probably take advantage of it. Yeah, that’s the way things work in that part.

Tony Nash

Of course. Of course. Tracy, we had some viewer questions about natgas. There were probably four of them on Twitter. What new insights do you have in natgas over the last couple of weeks?

Tracy

Well, as far as natgas is concerned, everybody’s asking when is this market going to bottom? Right? Because it’s been just a disaster since summer. We’ve seen like over 40% decline and in my opinion, really what we should be looking at right now, I think we’ll probably consolidate down here for a while. I think what we should be looking for is going into summer because what I think it’s going to happen is that we’re going to see China demand increase because they’re coming back online and cargoes that were bound for the EU will probably go to China now. They’ll outbid the EU because EU is basically full at this juncture, right. So they don’t really need the cargoes. Those cargoes can move to Asia. But during the summer, what we may see happen is increase. And we got very lucky with the EU as far as winter was concerned. And what I think will happen is during summer, if we have a particularly hot summer, air conditioning rises, that means nat gas increases. And so what I think we could see is somewhere this summer we see an increase in prices again because you have to realize that last year EU still had 50% of their capacity filled from Russia before everything went offline. That’s gone.

Tony Nash

Right.

Tracy

I would be looking towards, more towards this summer if you’re looking for kind of price increase. And generally right now I think that we’re probably going to see some consolidation down in this 2, 2.50 area, which is where it’s traditionally traded.

Tony Nash

My neighbors in Texas need more money, so let’s get that pumping.

Tracy

But the thing is that at this, the producers in Texas that their costs are higher, that production is going to drift if we stayed up long enough. So you have to think about that as far as production is concerned anyway, I mean, we are in surplus right now, but that may not last forever.

Tony Nash

Great. Okay. Very good. That’s really good. Thank you for that. Hey Tony, what does next week look like for you? I know we’ve got CPI coming out. What are you looking at for the week ahead?

Tony Greer

I’m thinking like Carl icon, to be honest with you. Tony. No, I’m serious. If you saw his options play, I guess he’s got, I guess it’s 5 billion notional of options that are struck at 40, 50 for next Friday. If you ask me, he’s looking at number, he’s looking at a couple of things. He’s looking first at I think the bond market, the credit markets in terms of the bonds and break evens in terms of yields and break evens trading higher in the last week, they have both vaulted off of the lows. So there’s been a clear turnaround in market based inflation perception. So I think that he sees that and looks on the calendar and sees CPI and PPI next week, knows that inflation is not linear in any direction and maybe is making a bet on and maybe it’s just a hedge, but maybe investing that money on the idea that we have an upside surprise in any of the economic data. The bond market tanks, stocks tank. If rates go higher, they’re going to mash big tech again and he’s probably going to be in the money and his 40-50 puts.

Tony Greer

So that’s how I’m looking at it. I’m looking to see if my portfolio of trades that I’ve got on can weather that type of storm and if I’m out of the way in certain places, if I should join him in certain places. That’s the way I’m thinking about next week, man. I’m trying to stay alive.

Tony Nash

Sounds very exciting. Tracy, what are you looking for next week?

Tracy

Continue, obviously watching the commodities markets, metals, energy, watching China data, the mobility data, flight data, see how this is moving along and we’ll see how that.

Tony Nash

We see a higher CPI, what does that do for crude prices, do you think? Do you think there’s a direct impact?

Tracy

I think you’re going to see crude prices go higher, yeah.

Tony Greer

Tone, what, the dynamics…

Tracy

Counterintuitive, right?

Tony Greer

Yeah. It’s kind of like the market speak to each other, right. Like a dynamic that we definitely saw along the way of the commodities rally as rates went higher last year. Right. Call it the whole period going into the Russia Ukraine invasion, right. It was oil straight up, but it was kind of like the credit market. I called two year yields last year the bat signal, and I named them that because they were getting out ahead of commodity inflation. We were having weeks where the bond market was getting shellac and there wasn’t much going on in the commodity markets, but all of a sudden they would pick up at the end of the week. And I think it was a lot of the time, like the bond market signaling inflation here. The commodity markets are going to go up. And I think that that’s kind of a sort of a cadence that established itself. And so it’s going to be really interesting to see how that unwinds.

Tony Nash

Fantastic. Okay. That’s a really great explanation, Tony. Thank you. Thank you so much. I really appreciate your time. Thanks so much. Have a great weekend and have a great week ahead. Thank you.

Tony Greer

Thanks for having us. Be good. Bye.

Tracy

Thank you.

Week Ahead

The End of the USD Era? How Natgas Prices, The Fed, and a Multipolar World are Changing the Game?

Post author By admin
Post date January 7, 2023

⚠️ The Inflation Buster Sale is extended until Jan. 7th only! Learn more: http://completeintel.com/inflationbuster 👈

Natgas is down 63% from its high in late August. The average price before Q2 ’21 was $2-3, so we only have 7% more to fall to below $3. While we saw Natgas rise – along with every other commodity – in 2021, prices had begun to fall until Russia invaded Ukraine.

Russia and Ukraine are still at war, but we have this issue with the restart of the LNG terminal. Tracy Shuchart tells us what’s behind the fall in Natgas prices and what she’d look for before expecting prices to stop falling.

The Fed pivot has been wishful thinking for quite a while and Sam Rines has been repeating this for months or so. As the Fed’s minutes were released last week, Sam pointed out that NO MEMBER saw the need for a rate rise in 2023. He stated many times that the Fed has been very clear about its indicators. We see this so often that it seems obvious. Why is this so difficult for some people to see? Sam Rines explains that in this episode.

This week, Sam also made the point that the Fed is maybe “stuck in the middle”. Literally, employment in the middle of the US could be a factor that keeps the Fed from slowing down. Sam explains why the middle is so important.

We’ve seen a lot of chatter in research notes, op-eds, and tweets over the last week stating that the future is a multipolar world. This seems largely based on a call for the decline of the USD and the rise of the petroyuan, etc. Albert Marko walks us through this.

Key themes:

1. Natgas sub $3?
2. The Fed Pivot is Dead
3. Multipolar, Post-USD World

This is the 48th episode of The Week Ahead, where experts talk about the week that just happened and what will most likely happen in the coming week.

Follow The Week Ahead panel on Twitter:

Tony: https://twitter.com/TonyNashNerd
Tracy: https://twitter.com/chigrl
Sam: https://twitter.com/SamuelRines
Albert: https://twitter.com/amlivemon

Transcript

Tony

Hi, everyone, and welcome to the Week Ahead. I’m Tony Nash. This week we are joined by Tracy Shuchart, Albert Marko, and Sam Rines. Thank you guys for taking the time to join us this week.

It’s been a pretty volatile short week, and there are a number of things we’re talking about. First is Natgas. We’ve seen Natgas come off pretty dramatically this week, and we’re going to talk to Tracy about whether or not we’re going to see Natgas below $3 soon. Also the Fed pivot. There’s been a lot of statements from the Fed, and Sam’s covered that in detail, so it looks pretty dead. But we want to find out from Sam what’s going on. And we’ve also seen a lot of coverage of or a lot of commentary about a multipolar world in the last week or two, which sounds like 2006 era rhetoric or something, but we’re seeing a lot of that kind of rear its head again, and we want to talk through that with Albert. Thanks, guys. Tracy, let’s jump into it with with Natgas. Natgas is down something like 63% from its high in late August. I’ve got a price chart on the screen right now.

The average price before Q two of 21 was in the two to $3 range, 260 or something like that. So I only have 7% more to fall below $3. So we’ve seen it rise with every other commodity in 2021. But of course, with Russia invading Ukraine, we saw that spike up. So Russia and Ukraine are obviously still at war. And then we have this issue with an LNG terminal in Texas with Freeport. So we’ve got that story from Bloomberg up on the screen right now.

Can you tell us what is behind that Nat gas price fall, and what are you looking for in that market for that to stop?

Tracy

Well, first, again, Freeport, since you already put that up right, which went down in August, and people have been waiting for that facility to reopen because it’s an export facility. What happens is that since that facility is shut down, that landlocked US. Nat gas or that pushed downward pressure on US. Nat gas. Originally they were supposed to reopen in October. Then it was November, then it was December, and now it’s mid January. So that does contribute to a lot of problems. We’re also seeing warmer weather right now in the EU, and stocks are full in the EU. This market has become very complacent. That said, if we’re looking forward, there is a cold front coming in, I think January 22 to the EU. It’s supposed to be really cold for a few weeks. So what traders will be watching is to see how much does their build bring down during that time. But again, yes, the markets have become very complacent. They think that they’re indicative that this crisis is over, but that’s not necessarily true. We’ll have to see this winter how much stock is brought down in Europe due to cold weather.

Tracy

And you have to remember that in 2022, half of their storage came from cheap Russian gas pipeline. Right. So looking forward to when we have to refill this, they’re going to have more expensive LNG coming in, and that takes longer and it’s more expensive. And then we look at US. Export capacity. It’s still not built out enough for the contracts that we actually signed with the EU. So that may put pressure on US. Nat gas, but that would put upward pressure on European nat gas.

Tony

So does that pressure, does it drive the price up or does it just hold the price steady? Is there a mean reversion at some point where we go to, say, 260 or 270 on average and kind of some of these weather issues and Restocking just kind of maintains it? Or do you expect things to go back up to $9 or whatever?

Tracy

I think we could see a spike. Again, there’s a lot of mitigating factors in this market right now, and we really have to see how much is pulled from storage in Europe at this point. And hopefully Freeport is supposed to open mid January. We’ll see if that happens.

Tony

Okay.

Tracy

But that would really leave a lot of the downward pressure on prices in the US. Market because it would open us up to being able to export that.

Tony

We also saw the Japanese buying a US. Nacas company this past week. Right. Can you talk to us a little bit about that?

Tracy

Yeah, which makes sense. I mean, Japan has been one of the largest natural gas importers in the world, and they’re very concerned right now about energy security, as most countries are, particularly in Asia. They’ve had some problems with their deal with Russia because they have a joint project together, and due to sanctions, there are some problems involved in that. And so I think that was a very smart move, again, for Japan to kind of secure energy. I mean, they’re looking forward, much more forward than I would say Europe is.

Tony

Okay. Very good. So it sounds to me that there’s not really anything decisive coming up in the near term to change the direction, but the magnitude may slow.

Tracy

Is that yeah, technically speaking, we are very oversold at this point. That said, what we really are going to have to be looking at, or what traders should be looking at moving forward is do we have this reopening of Freeport mid January and this cold front coming in? If it does, traders will be looking at how much draw is is going to happen in in Europe or Bill stock? Okay.

Albert

Not to mention, Tony, that planting season for 2020, late 2023 and 2024 is coming up in Fertilizer. You need that gas fertilizer. So that’s that’s something else to look at. I’m not sure exactly how much it weighs on it or a bullish case from that gas by any means, but something will keep your eye on.

Tracy

Right.

Tony

But we have had some fertilizer volatility over the past couple of years, right? Oh, yeah. Russian invasion.

Albert

Yeah, I’ve been a big mosaic fan, which is a phosphate play, but also nat gas is the other component on the other side for the fertilizers that they use.

Tony

Great. Tracy, what’s your thought on fertilizer?

Tracy

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I think we’ve seen that obviously pull back, but we’re heading into planting season again starting in the spring. So again, that’s going to be another factor as far as not gas is concerned. And the fertilizer analysts that I’ve talked to say they expect another price spike coming into about March.

Albert

Yeah, I believe also there’s going to be a price spike on the fertilizer front because the soil that the farmers haven’t used can’t sit as from what I’m told, can’t sit around not being used for too long. So 23,024 they’ll have to be replanting, those fields.

Tony

Interesting. Okay, well, good to know. Thanks for all of that. So let’s move on to the Fed. Sam, you’ve put out a few notes this week about the Fed and the Fed Pivot. Obviously, you’ve been saying for about nine months that the Fed Pivot is kind of wishful thinking. You’ve said it over and over and over again and there haven’t been hasn’t been a lot of kind of listening to it or people really haven’t heeded that necessarily as we see kind of run ups and and hope that we’ll see a pivot. But Fed minutes were released this week and you pointed out no member saw a need to raise rates in 2023. So that from your newsletter is on the screen right now.

So you’ve stated many times that the Fed has been very clear what their indicators are. And honestly, we’re seeing what you’ve said many times, that it’s vu and nominal wages. So vacancies and unemployment as well as nominal wages as well as core services, excluding shelter inflation.

And those have been very clearly stated by the Fed chair in his briefings. So why is it so difficult for people to see these things that seem to be very clearly stated by the Fed?

Sam

It’s personal preference. Right. The presuppositions and the initial conditions that you want based on the way you’re positioned. Right. So our brains really like to be correct. So if we can convince ourselves that the Fed is doing the wrong thing and should do something else and ignore the Fed will do something different, then it makes us feel a little bit better. So I think that’s part of it. But I do think that there’s something to be said for when no member of the FOMC sees the need to cut rates in 2023. That should be heated. That’s a pretty one sided trade. And you listen to some of the members of the Fed this week, bostic, who could be considered one of the more dovish individuals. He was still somewhat indeterminate between hiking 25 and 50 at the next meeting. When the most dovish member that I can kind of come up with or one of them doesn’t know if they’re going 25 or 50, that’s, that’s problematic. Right? That’s, that’s something that I think people are somewhat ignoring, particularly market participants, is that the Fed is not the Fed is not pivoting towards being dovish at this point.

Right. That the narrative that they have put out for the last six months has not changed. It has been very consistent and it has been very clear that vacancies to unemployment is a problem because one, when you poach people, you have to pay them a lot more money. So instead of call it the ADP report is really intriguing because they release what the pay rates are for people who aren’t switching jobs. It’s somewhere in the seven percentage range and the people who are switching jobs are getting 15% pay bumps. So the differential there is somewhat stark and somewhat shocking. I think that is somewhat underestimated by people when they look at what’s going on in the labor market. We have had a very good year for job creation and we just finished it off with a number that was well above expectations. And, you know, you can kind of nitpick and say, well, the average hourly wage was only up 30, basis points 0.3%. And you know, that’s that’s a positive for the Fed. Well, yeah, it’s only going to be up .3% because the vast majority of jobs were created in lower paying industries.

When you create jobs in leisure and hospitality, those are below the median. So you’re going to drag down the wage growth just naturally on that front. So I think a lot of it is going to be evolutionary for the Fed, right. They’re going to have to evolve their rhetoric at some point, but they’re not going to do it yet and they’re certainly not going to do it before the February FOMC meeting and they’re probably not going to do it until after the March 1. And that to me is probably not priced in at this point. And what’s really not priced in is the Fed just not really caring about the data until sometime in early 2024.

Tony

So you mentioned that in one of your newsletters, I think it was yesterday, talking about on Thursday most recent employment report. You talked about the Fed being stuck in the middle and literally you put some maps, which I put on screen.

Employment in the middle of the US could be a factor that keeps the Fed from slowing rate rises or at least from kind of pivoting. So why is the middle so important? We get so much coverage of what’s happening in Silicon Valley or New York or whatever, but why is the middle so important? And why is the Fed paying so much attention to the middle?

Sam

Sure, so the regions to the west were the only ones that lost jobs, according to the ADP report, which is pretty interesting. And the rest of the country made up for it and made up for it in spades. So while all the tech layoffs get a lot of headlines, you never really hear about the opening of XYZ plant in Kentucky or Tennessee, or the building of a plant in Tennessee, right? Those don’t get the headlines that Facebook laying off a few thousand people get. Quite frankly, who cares about a bunch of people getting laid off from Facebook? They probably shouldn’t have had jobs in the first place. Even say I’ll say it about alphabet. I’ll say it about all the tech companies. They overhired and they overhired in the wrong area, and now they’re laying them off. I mean, that’s what happens. It’s called the tech cycle. It’s not that difficult. But middle America is more than making up for it, and it’s making up for it in spades. And I think the Fed actually might be getting caught by the middle of the country. And it’s kind of the revenge of middle America, right?

Middle America always takes the brunt of the BS from the coast in terms of being dominated on monetary policy, being dominated on economic policy, and now they’re the ones kind of driving the ship. And I think that’s really underestimated within people’s frameworks that when we’re isolated to New York and California and see people getting laid off, that doesn’t really matter to the Fed as long as it’s being made up for by people in the middle. And people in the middle are making more money and they continue to spend. And there’s a lot of states in the Midwest and call it just flyover states. There’s a lot of states with a two handle on unemployment. A two handle. So if you want to hire people in middle America, guess what? You’re going to have to pay up if you want to hire a tech worker on the West Coast. Maybe you don’t, but that’s what’s going to get the headlines. But you’re going to have to pay up in the middle.

Tony

Well, you may not have to in terms of the rise on the West Coast, but the wages there aren’t necessarily coming down, are they, on the West Coast?

Sam

No, they’re not coming down, but it’s all about wage growth at this point. As long as you have a pretty sharp deceleration, you have some people on the market to hire. That’s important, right? Nevada and California have two of the highest unemployment rates in the country.

Tony

So is it fair to say that the middle is not say perfectly, but in some extent kind of catching up with the coast in terms of, say, real wages or something or no. No. Okay, so it’s still pretty cheap, but still just wage growth. Okay, very good. What else are we missing? Because look, you have been consistent on all of this. And you have for anybody who’s either listened to us or read your stuff for the last nine months could have seen this play out pretty much exactly as you’ve laid out. So what are people missing? I think the Fed has been fairly boringly, consistent, and you’ve said they would be, and that’s what’s happened. So are there any lines to read between that we should be looking at right now?

Sam

Yeah, so I laid it out about a week ago that I think what you really want to look for is the Fed going from a hawk to a grackle, hawkish to grackleish. And if you live in Texas, have lived in Texas, grackles are the worst birds ever because all they do is squawk. They wake you up and you can’t shoot them. They’re not like dubs, so play that all the way through there. But Grackles are an incredibly annoying creature. And when the Fed goes from being pure hawkish to really starting to grackle up its communication, squawk, squawk, squawk. You have no idea what they’re looking at. You have no idea what the metrics are. That’s when they’re getting ready to pause and pivot. And frankly, we have seen none of that right. Until the Fed process is not hawk to dove or dove to hawk, it’s dove, grackle, hawk, hawk, grackle, dove. And until they really begin to confuse their messages, they’re not changing shape. That we simply haven’t seen them begin to change shape. I do think that sometime this year, probably in the call, it the May to June time frame. That’s when you’re really going to begin to see the Grackles come out.

And a lot of confusing language about what they’re watching. A lot of confusing talk about the balance sheet. A lot of confusing talk about the future, the path of Fed Funds rates. And that’s really when I’ll get a little more bulled up on a Fed pause in the length and the structure of the potential to pivot. I don’t think there is a reasonable case to be made at this point. The Fed is going to cut in 2023. If there is a credible argument, it’s that the Fed breaks something and has to cut a lot. Right. So it’s it’s a little bit of a call. It a convex play here that if the Fed does cut, it’s not it’s not cutting 50 basis points, it’s cutting two or 300. And if and on the other side, you know, if nothing bad happens or nothing very bad happens, the Fed is just going to hold it there. So I think there’s a little bit of skew here.

Tony

Great.

Tracy

Okay, thank you. I have one question. Yesterday we had, like, Fed george came out and said the Fed, quote unquote, Fed, still has a lot to learn about how balance sheet policy works. Can you explain that to the audience? And would that not be one of your grackle birds? What is it called?

Sam

No, I think it was actually George just being honest. I think we had this convers we had this conversation a few weeks ago, Tony and I, with a guest that the Fed really doesn’t understand or doesn’t have quite the concept to pinpoint exactly how much tightening or additional tightening to Fed funds. Quantitative tightening does that’s, that’s what George was getting at. She’s a little bit behind the curve there. The Fed does have a proxy rate that I pointed out earlier this week in a, in a note. The Fed has a proxy rate that they publish that’s sitting at about 6.4%, give or take. So it’s about a 260 basis point spread, 2.6% spread to the current Fed funds rate. I think that’s something to kind of pay attention to, is that the Fed does have measures. I think it’s more that if you’re out there talking all the time, it’s difficult to get into the math.

Tony

They’re not stupid, they’re just annoying at times.

Sam

Exactly. They’re not stupid. They’re really not stupid. They know how tight they are. They know they’re sitting at about six and a half percent, 6.4% on an overall tightening basis. They don’t care that’s number one. They don’t care that it’s that tight. Number two, they’re going to continue to do it until they actually achieve their mission. Right. And it’s a multipronged process. And as long as markets seem to be fixated on what’s going on with the Fed funds rate and not going on with the entirety of tightening, that’s going to continue to be an issue for them. Like today, when everybody’s like, oh, look, we printed 223,000 jobs. Maybe this gives them reason to pause because average hourly earnings didn’t go up that much. Guess what? I mean, you can’t rip markets 2% and have financial conditions loosen like that and have the Fed go, yeah, I think we’re accomplishing our mission. Inflation is still high and unemployment is at 3.5%. Yeah, it sounds like a great time to pivot. Yeah, that’s the dumbest thing I’ve ever heard.

Tony

Right? Yeah. Okay, that’s great. Speaking of stupid not you, Sam. Albert, let’s talk about multipolarity.

Albert

One of my favorite.

Tony

Yeah, so we’ve had a lot of op eds and research notes and tweets over the past week or two stating that the future is a multipolar world. And this seems to be based on a lot of talk about the decline of the US dollar or the rise of the petrieon or something like that, around Chinese crude purchases from the Middle East or whatever. So, Albert, you put a series of tweets out, which I’m showing right now on screen about this very diplomatic, as you always are.

So can you walk us through this and help us understand what’s going on? And I’m going to try to play devil’s advocate as you lay.

Albert

No, that’s fine. I mean, you can play devil’s advocate if you want, but when it comes to multipolarity, it’s not simply a financial or economic thing that you need to look at. There’s multiple variables, including legal frameworks of the nation that is the currency issuer, the military strength of the reserve currency issuer. There’s multiple, multiple variables for it. And for some reason we have these economists that come out and say, oh well, the petroleum is coming into effect and that’s going to destroy the petro dollar and therefore the dollar is going to fall and blah, blah, blah. I’ll let Tracy get into the petrowan stupidity, but the dollar is simply the lifeblood of all trade in the financial system. You’re talking about for me, it’s like taking out your blood into Transfusion and putting in Mountain Dew and saying, oh yeah, everything’s healthy, you’re going to be fine. The whole system is raring to go. It’s a dumb argument. It just boggles my mind how people can sit there and even claim multipleity when there’s literally no alternative on a global scale for anyone to be thrown.

Tony

So let’s take this bit by bit. Okay? So a lot of these people are saying that the CNY will become more powerful partly on the back of crude coming out of the Middle East and crude coming out of Europe that could be denominated in CNY. Okay, so let’s take that. Tracy, can you talk to us about the Shanghai benchmark for crude? How successful has that been?

Tracy

Not at all. Even the futures market hasn’t been successful.

Tony

What percent of world order oil, just as a wild guess, do you think is traded on the Shanghai benchmark?

Tracy

2%.

Tony

2%. Okay. And it’s been around for how long? Two years?

Tracy

Yes. And if you look at their futures market, which has been around since 2016, we’re still only saying that domestically traded, you’re not seeing big players come in and hedge like they do with WTI or bread. So that aside, China came to Saudi Arabia with a suggestion after this new summit, the latest summit that they just had, and said, yeah, we would love for you to we could trade this on Shanghai and this could be traded in yuan. Saudi Arabia still has not yet come back with an answer. And so everybody jumped to conclusion saying it’s a petrol. Saudi Arabia is giving up dollar denominated oil. This is not true. I’ve talked to a lot of people in Saudi Arabia about this. I’ve talked to a lot of journalists. I actually had a spaces about it. So this is not true. And even if Saudi Arabia did decide to sell some oil in yuan on the Shanghai exchange, for whatever reason, all that would happen is they would be paid in yuan and instantly changes into dollars. Nobody wants you.

Tony

Wait a minute, let’s dig into that. Why does nobody want CMY?

Tracy

Well, because it’s not globally traded like the dollar is. Everybody wants dollars. People don’t want you on it.

Tony

Not freely convertible.

Tracy

Right. At all. Right. And especially if you’re in a merging market with USD denominated debt. You on. Nobody wants you on. Nobody wants you on. Right. And it’s not really free floating, right?

Tony

It’s not at all. We talk about crude and the ability for the Chinese purchase crude. We talk about their currency, CNY. But behind the CNY and the lack of convertibility is the PDOC, right. China central bank. So ultimately, if you trust a currency, you ultimately trust their central bank. So is there a basis for people globally to trust the PBOC? That’s a sincere question. It’s not a cynical question.

Tracy

No, I think people are not trusting central banks anywhere, but especially in China right now. People don’t believe what’s going on in China right now. People haven’t believed the data in China right now. And so, again, there will be a small amount of oil traded globally in yuan if China wants to do so and another country chooses to do that. Right? Russia has india was brought up for them, but that’s a very small 1% to 2% of globally traded oil, which is certainly not going to put the U on in a position to overtake the dollar in traded markets.

Tony

And something I’ll point out is the PBOC has literally, at times, used numerology to determine their benchmark rate. Okay? For people who go down this path, that the CNY is a rising currency. If you’re going to trust a currency, first of all, it has to be convertible. But second of all, you have to trust the central bank. And you can’t have people using numerology. I know we all complain about the Fed, right? But at least there’s a standard approach and there is a level of transparency as to the way decisions are made, right? Everybody knows what the Fed says, what minutes are released and all that stuff. But when you have a central bank that has at times and it’s rare, but at times use numerology by raising by anything that ends in eight or whatever, something like that, I mean, this is just stupid. And it’s not a credible central bank when those sorts of things are happening. Okay, let’s go on to multiplarity, to have defense. Okay? So is there a defense to enforce decisions that are made? So does China or whatever other multipolar places that these people are talking about have the ability to enforce their decisions overseas?

Albert

No, none. None whatsoever. I mean, even to take the Saudis as an example, right? The Saudis rolled out the red carpet for the Chinese, and the Petrowan argument started coming out all over research papers. But what will happen when Iran decides to press the Saudis once again in Yemen, or just through airspace violations and threatening missiles? Do you think that Riyadh is going to run to the Chinese? Are they going to run to Moscow? Or are they going to call up the Pentagon and say, hey, we need more, you know, Patriot missile batteries, you know, we need your support.

Tony

You tell me why. I think I know the answer, but I want to understand why.

Albert

The US. Has the most advanced military hardware there is on Earth by far.

Tracy

Right?

Tony

But why would they not call, let’s say the Chinese.

Albert

Do you want an effective defense system? What are the Chinese have for defense system? Are the Chinese able to put Chinese troops to defend against Iran if something happens or against the Yemenis? I mean, they failed in every single aspect of China.

Tony

Just some basic questions. Does the PLA have the logistical capability to get their resources to Yemen if needed?

Albert

Zero. They couldn’t even invade Albania if they wanted to. That’s how ridiculous it is.

Tony

I’m sorry.

Albert

How are you going to move 250,000 troops across the world, right? You have no ability. The Russians can’t even barely invade Ukraine. That’s on their border, and we’re sitting there talking about multipolarity. For an example, is the United States took out Manuel Noriega. That’s because he was in the Panama Canal area and he was screwing around. If that situation happened, do you think the Chinese or the Russians did hop on over there and take it out? They cut it.

Tony

Noriega fell out of a building, which is plausible.

Albert

Well, that’s the Russian way to fix things. But, I mean, this is just a silly conversation. I have no idea where this multiplarity is coming from unless it’s investment banks putting their analysts out there to help their clients get out of gold or get out of crypto or something. We know with the whole death of the dollar thing coming, what are we.

Tony

Missing on multi polarity? Is there something that we’re missing from this discussion on either side?

Sam

I don’t think we’re missing much. I mean, there’s always the want for multipolarity if you’re not the United States, right? Everybody wants it, but to the point. You have to have a credible currency, you have to have an open account, you have to be willing to have a deficit, trade deficit, period. And you have to have incredible military and defense. And guess what? In this world, the only country that ticks those boxes is the US. And if Europe ever got its act together, maybe it could have the military part, but that’s it. China simply does not have the capability to be a global offsetter to the US dominance. That’s simply what I would call fantasy, at least for the foreseeable future. Could it become one down the line?

Tony

Maybe.

Sam

We were all concerned about Japan 20 years ago. Look how that worked out. Then we were concerned about the Euro. Look how that worked out. I mean, it happens. Yeah, it happens on a cyclical basis. Every 20 years, we come up with a new thing to be concerned about on the multiplayer front, and every single time, nobody has the willingness to do what the US does. Somebody call it the exorbitant privilege. Right? It’s not. It is. Actually a pretty big load to bear, particularly on the military and spending front. So I think that’s wildly overlooked. And I think the other thing that’s overlooked is oil for dollars will persist for a meaningful amount of time. Nobody wants oil for Trinkets.

Tony

Right?

Tracy

And another thing I have to mention, does China even want to open up enough to be the world? They like to be shrouded in kind of secrecy, right? And they have to be secret. Whatever. If you’re world current reserve currency, you have to be completely open to the world, and they don’t seem to like that.

Tony

Well, part of it is they don’t want to be embarrassed. They don’t want to be seen to be making a mistake. It’s easier to point out other people’s mistakes. If they had transparency and they made a mistake, it’s embarrassing. If you remember, in 2015, they tried to devalue a little bit, they messed up and they way overshot, and it was really embarrassing. And then they did nothing for, like, four years. So they don’t want to be embarrassed. That’s a huge issue.

Albert

These are all complexities that have to be taken into account. And like Sam said, there’s only one nation at the moment that ticks the box. And listen, I’d be the first one to throw out warnings, red flags. If there was a competitor stepping up in the US’s shadow, they’d be the first person to say this, but just not right now. None of the components are there at the moment.

Tony

Right? And I mean, having said all this, I don’t want this to sound super pro American. Like, we’re all Americans, and I think we can all agree that the US is kind of a lumbering idiot around the US at times. Well, this is not trying to say raw, raw US. We’re just saying the Pragmatism of the moment is this.

Albert

Yeah, there’s so many different details that have to be looked at. And I spoke with Mike Green on this in our podcast and our spaces. It’s like the United States has water, has geography, is isolated from the rest of the world, has a military, has this, has that. It’s nothing to do about RA America. It’s just the way things have been laid out at the moment.

Sam

We’re lucky in that.

Tony

So if anybody’s watching and has a counter argument, please let us know. Honestly, we want to hear it and put it down there, and I’ll try to talk to Albert and see if he can come back to you. You may be careful what you wish for, but we’ll try to get Albert to come back to you. But let us know seriously, if there are valid counterarguments that encompass all these issues, just let us know in the comments, and we’d love to engage. So, guys, thank you very much. Really appreciate your time and all the thought you put into this. And have a great weekend. Thank you.

Albert

Thank you.

Sam

Thank you.

Podcasts

UK Prime Minister Truss pledges action on rising energy bills

Post author By admin
Post date September 8, 2022

This podcast is originally published by BBC Business Matters here: https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/w172ydq0jbyj4ls

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UK Prime Minister Liz Truss is expected to announce a package of support to deal with rising energy bills in the coming days. It’s understood the government could spend $115 million on plans to subsidise bills. We weigh up the pros and cons of subsidies and windfall taxes with Caroline Meyer, energy analyst and CEO of Meyer Resources.

US e-cigarette maker Juul is to pay a $438.5 million settlement, following a lengthy investigation that found it had marketed its products to underage teenagers. Rachel Butt from Bloomberg in New York explains the background and implications of the story.

Rahul Tandon is joined from Austin, Texas by Tony Nash, CEO and founder of Complete Intelligence, and from Freetown, Sierra Leone by media entrepreneur and TV presenter Stella Bangura.

Transcript

BBC

Hello, there. How are you? This, of course, is Business Matters here on the BBC World Service. I’m Rahul Tandon as always, coming up on the program, we’re talking about changing your leaders. Does it work? That’s happened here in the UK. Liz Truss was sworn in into her new job. We’re going to be looking at the energy challenges that many countries, many of you listeners, are facing at the moment.

BBC

It’s going to be a terrible winter and in many countries, it will be for some of the lower income households. It will literally be a question, do I heat or do I eat?

BBC

There we go. That is a question I think that many people, unfortunately, across the world, will be facing. A lot of tough questions that are going to face businesses here in the UK. Tony Nash joins us as well this evening from Complete Intelligence. Hello, Tony. Always a pleasure to have you on the program. Our new Prime Minister here is going to need a lot of intelligence. Can I ask you, Tony, sometimes when we’re faced with big problems, we think, let’s just change the leader. That doesn’t always work, does it? Just putting a new person in charge. The problems are still there.

The problems are still there. And the problems that we have right now are very hard problems to solve. So Liz Truss is going to really need a lot of help and a lot of deep thought to solving these problems.

BBC

Let’s switch it on its head, though, sometimes, having that new leadership in place, new ideas, new thoughts. She announced her new team a short while ago, Tony, that can make a difference. A fresh look at difficult problems that people are facing, whether it’s countries or businesses as well.

Sure it can. I think some of the problems she’s facing right now, though, are they’re global problems. It’s the energy supply chain, right? It’s the cost of energy, it’s the downstream costs of energy. It’s the cost of things like fertilizer and food into next year. So these are not problems that the head of the UK, the leader of the UK, can solve on their own. This is something that really takes some deep thought to solve, say, the domestic symptoms of those problems, or not the symptoms, but the domestic impacts of those problems, as well as the global sources of those problems. It takes a lot of effort, especially for a new leader, to come in, set up their team and get going.

BBC

Yeah, that’s a good point. Tony, last question to you on this particular issue. Sometimes with leadership, the key is knowing when to take over. This is not the best time for any leader to take over in the country because of those problems you outlined there, which we’re going to be talking about in the program in a lot more detail a bit later.

No, you’re exactly right, but I think there’s a certain kind of leader that’s attracted to taking over in a very difficult time. So I’ve done a turnaround and a couple of startups in my day, and it takes a different kind of person who to want to take a leadership position in that situation. And hopefully she’s a person who is focused. Hopefully she’s a person who can take criticism really well. Hopefully she’s a person who can get people on her team and build trust. And if she can do those things and all of the other things that a leader is supposed to do, she may actually do really well.

BBC

Stella, you were talking about the elections in Sierra Leone, which are coming up by the beginning of next year. I wonder we’re talking about leadership. I suppose the true test of a leader or somebody who wants to be a leader is taking over in difficult circumstances. Not when it’s easy, but when it’s tough. Against your labs. Tony, when you go around Texas, are you seeing a lot of youngsters vaping nowadays?

I have two kids in university and one in junior high. And my kids who are in university were part of that initial group that was marketed to. And so when they were in high school, there was a lot of vaping in high school, and there still is. And even now the kids in junior high are being marketed. And so when I say junior high, that’s kind of 12, 13, 14 years old.

So are they being directly marketed to? Probably not. But the problem here yes, that’s right. And the influencers and the way that they get to these kids, and there are efforts in the schools here to counter that. A lot of the messaging in the schools is countering, and again, I’m talking 12, 13, 14 years old is countering vaping and trying to get the kids to not start vaping. So it is something that’s very common even at a young age, and there are a lot of efforts to really stop it.

BBC

Yeah, go on, Tony.

Yeah, the appeal here for the kids, there are a couple of appeals. First of all, they don’t smell like tobacco, right? So it’s a lot easier to do and conceal. But the other part that’s pretty common is to get vape use that has THC in it. And kids in, say, public schools will smoke in the bathroom between classes or something like that. But it’s the THC juice for their vape.

BBC

Because I’m listed, I know what that is.

It’s basically smoking marijuana, right? It’s the THC is the active ingredient in marijuana. And so it’s a very easy and pretty inconspicuous way to distribute this to schools, to kids in schools. And so it’s not necessarily nicotine, it’s the THC. I’m not saying every kid who vapes has THC in their vape juice, but it’s both. And it’s balancing both out that we see a lot in the junior highs and high schools here.

BBC

I want to bring in Tony here very quickly, because I remember being in India when the government had demonetization completely changed the currency. It’s not that easy, is it? Sometimes?

No, it’s not easy. It’s a shock. And I think that it’s a little bit of a shock by design so that people understand the new value. But when it doesn’t hold, then that’s a real problem. So I’m not laughing at this specific situation now, but with demonetization in India, obviously, that had an organized crime drive, right? Like they wanted to take out the large bills to take the power out of some of the organized crime transactions. Is that fair?

BBC

Yeah, it was. It was also about removing some black money from the economy. Did it work? It’s an interesting discussion that’s still going on in India. Lots more interesting discussions coming up here on Business Matters after the latest news.

BBC

What about where you are in Texas? That’s a part of the world that is known, isn’t it, for its energy resources? It’s fossil fuels, also renewables. Now we’re heading towards Midterms. How big an issue is energy there? Not quite as big maybe as it is in Europe, I suppose.

Well, I live in Houston, Texas, the energy capital of the world. So you should know that everyone in my neighborhood has put in a new swimming pool except me over the past year. So the energy companies are doing well and my neighbors are benefiting. And so I don’t say that to be horrible, but these times part of the problem with times like this is people realize that there is actually under investment in energy.

And so whether it’s electric, power companies or storage or transmission, other things, so what comes out of Texas is natural gas, which goes to Europe to kind of fill the gap that isn’t coming from Russia. Okay. And so because there’s not as much supply, those prices go up, and that benefits the people who take things out. But the under investment happens in two places. It happens kind of on the electricity side, but also on the extraction side. So things here actually in Texas pretty good, and we’re not seeing a lot of the downsides that Europe is seeing.

BBC

Yeah, very much. And I suppose the price of the gas at the moment, a lot of that liquefied gas coming into Europe at the moment means that a lot of those companies in Texas will be doing very well. We were talking about Liz Truss earlier in the program, the new British Prime Minister, because she’s unveiling her energy plan a little bit later this week, on Thursday. But it’s quite clear now that her government’s going to borrow hugely to keep bills low. In the EU, though, Brussels are going to propose levies on energy companies that would channel sky high earnings back to vulnerable households and businesses.

BBC

This is going to cost Europe a huge amount of money because they’re going to have to bail out a lot of people because of the rising cost of energy here and that’s going to have long term economic consequences for the continent.

Sure, yeah and I think that whenever you get a governor estimate, it’s always a little bit low. So whatever the governments are putting out to spend, you can probably count on two times that or more maybe then. Sure, yeah. The government estimates are intentionally low and they always are because they underestimate probably supply constraints in this case.

If you look at things like gas storage. So I’m not of the belief that we’re going to have like a horrific event in Europe this year or this winter because if you look at gas storage, for example, Germany has a natural gas storage, it’s something like 84% of reserves and their target is 95% and they’ll fill that 95% by probably November. So there will be supplies of gas in Europe. It will be expensive.

So as your guest said, people will have to choose between food and heating. I don’t necessarily think that’s the case. If you look at the German government, they have the capacity to issue a massive amount of debt to pay their people to survive through the winter. So not every government in Europe has that luxury, but Germany certainly does and a lot of northern European governments too.

BBC

Well, we did see, didn’t we, earlier this week, the Chancellor of Germany outlining plans to help people will have Liz Truss do that as well. Texas, California, two rivals. I think a lot of our listeners across the world will be surprised to hear about blackouts in a state like California, one of the wealthiest in the US.

Well, yes, in California needs a lot of investment in its power grid. That’s really something that’s long overdue and they haven’t necessarily put the investment in. It’s got a creaking power grid and so this is why power is so inefficiently distributed in California. And until they do that they’re going to continue to have these brownouts and blackouts and power distribution problems.

BBC

And do you think that’s one of the reasons why we’ve seen a movement of quite a lot of businesses, haven’t we? It’s not just about taxation from California to your part of the world.

Yes, absolutely. It’s about regulation, it’s about the continuity of power and it’s about education. And the students that come out of Texas institutions are very good, very hard working students. So there are a lot of factors related to it. And land, there’s a lot of land in Texas that can be built on for things like Tesla and other places.

BBC

Stella well, that’s very similar to the situation in Bangalore, a city that you know well. As you Tony know very well, yes.

Gosh, I spent a lot of time in Bangalore about 20 years ago, before the new airport, before the second ring road, all of that stuff. So it was the same town, but it was a little bit different, not quite the scale that it has today, but the disasters there, it’s heartbreaking.

I moved to Texas in 2017 when we had a Hurricane Harvey, and one of the things your guest was talking about is how people would help each other out in Bangalore with the floods. And that’s exactly what we saw here where we went and helped ten or 20 people take all of their belongings out of their house and started new life. It’s heartbreaking.

BBC

It is indeed. And it has been a sad end to the program, talking about the city I know very well in Bangalore. Hopefully, I’ll get on its feet. Thanks to Tony. Thanks to Stella. We’ll be back same time, same place tomorrow.

Week Ahead

European Natgas: The Week Ahead – 5 Sep 2022

Post author By admin
Post date September 4, 2022

Learn more about CI Futures here: http://completeintel.com/2022Promo

This week we’ve seen a lot around dollar hitting almost 110. We’ve seen a lot in the US market downturn. There’s a lot of speculation around the Fed. But we’re really focusing on Europe this week.

Key themes:

1. European Natgas Stock vs Flow

2. Russian Oil Price Cap Fallout

3. Europe’s Food and Fertilizer Fallout

4. What’s ahead for next week?

This is the 32nd episode of The Week Ahead, where experts talk about the week that just happened and what will most likely happen in the coming week.

Follow The Week Ahead panel on Twitter:

Tony: https://twitter.com/TonyNashNerd

Albert: https://twitter.com/amlivemon/

Sam: https://twitter.com/samuelrines

Tracy: https://twitter.com/chigrl

Listen on Spotify

Time Stamps

0:00 Start

1:51 European natgas: stocks VS flows

8:26 What to expect in manufacturing in Europe

9:26 Difficult environment for the German Finance Ministry?

10:27 Fertilizer fallout and impacts on Europe’s food supply

14:19 Is Europe getting relief soon, or will this crisis continue to 2024?

15:33 Russian oil price cap: is it going to come about?

19:12 What’s to stop countries from indirectly buying Russian crude?

22:00 What’s for the week ahead?

Transcript

Tony Nash: Hi, and welcome to The Week Ahead. I’m Tony Nash. Today we’re joined by Sam Rines, Tracy Shuchart and Albert Marko. We’re going through the events this week and looking toward next week.

Before we get started, I’d like to ask you to like and subscribe. Please add your comments. We’re on top of the comments. We come back pretty quickly. We really want your engagement, so add those comments in.

Also we have a promo right now on our subscription product, CI Futures. That promo ends in two weeks. So you get forecast for about 3000 items. About 900 of those are renewed every week. We show you the forecast, the error rates, all sorts of stuff about all of these different assets, global assets. So please check it out. That runs out in mid September.

So this week we’ve seen a lot around dollar hitting almost 110. We’ve seen a lot in US market downturn. There’s, a lot of speculation around the Fed. But we’re really focusing on Europe this week.

The key themes this week are really around European natgas stock versus flows. Russian oil price caps and the fallout that has come with that. Food and fertilizer in Europe. And then we’ll look to the week ahead. So I think we’ll look at some non Europe activities for the week ahead.

First for European natgas, Sam Rines in his newsletter came out with some really interesting points around natural gas stocks and flows. You can see the chart on the screen. Sam, can you talk us through kind of what’s happening in storage for natural in Europe and what we should be looking for as winter approaches?

Sam Rines: Yeah, sure. So you get this really interesting dynamic where everybody talks about the stock but very few people talk about the flow. So talking about the stocks of that gas in Europe is a really interesting one. Yeah, you’ve got stocks building up pretty quickly, particularly in Germany, sitting north of 82% overall for European stocks in general, north of 80%.

So it’s good, right? Stocks seem to be well ahead of where you would anticipate. Germany has a 95 target for November. They might actually reach it even with the shutdown of Ms one, Nordstream One. It’s actually not that big of a deal incrementally to Germany in particular. You go from about call it a 3.2 kilowatt hour type pump into Germany to about a three.

You didn’t really lose that much. I mean, it was pretty much anticipated anyway. So if they keep it off

for longer, whatever. You don’t have significant usage coming through at the moment for natural gas.

It’s a time where you can actually afford to not have those significant closing. They’ll probably still have some stock bill that will just be slower.

So overall, I think it’s a lot of headlines that a lot of it’s already priced in. If you were looking at the expectations of complete and utter frozen winter, you’re pretty much not looking at that assuming that Norway and Belgium continue to put their flows through to Germany at the current rate.

So overall, you’re actually sitting on a decent call it stock level. Right? That’s fine. And as long as you continue to have the flows from call it Northern Europe, you should be okay for the winter. You’re not going to be great. It’s going to be expensive, and it’s going to suck. But relative to the expectation of Europe’s going to freeze this winter,

I think that might actually be a little bit of an overblown one, and you might begin to have a significant blowback on that. And you’ve seen significant declines in things like electricity pricing ahead, which is a ridiculous contract anyway. And Dutch TTF, the net gas contract you’ve seen collapse this week, even with the shutdown of Nordstream.

So I think a little bit of the froth, a little bit of that angst is beginning to come out of the market, and you might actually have a positive surprise relative to expectations in Europe.

TN: So Dutch TTF peaked on Tuesday or something, right? It was early in the week, right?

SR: Correct.

TN: And Tracy, what are you seeing with that? Do you expect us to hit back up to those peaks, and do you think that was kind of a one time hit? And what Sam saying about storage is really kind of starting to take hold.

Tracy Shuchart: I think it really depends over the long run and how slow go. I totally agree with Sam here. Right now, for winter, Europe is pretty much okay, not great, as he said, but I think given if we don’t see increased flows, that storage would drain significantly by February. So we really have to keep an eye on flows from other countries, particularly in the United States, in the Middle East, and to see how those flows go. So I think it’s too early to be completely doom and gloom, but that is something we need to be cognizant of, because that storage can only last until February.

TN: Right. And for those people who aren’t in Northern Europe, northern European winter really stays cold, really until like, April, right. It’s not something that February comes and goes and it’s spring and everything’s great. You still have cold temperatures in Northern Europe until probably April or so. Is that about right?

TS: Yeah, absolutely. Anecdotally, if you’re been on Twitter, you see a lot of people starting to buy wood. The big thing on the European sites is to post how much wood you collected before this winter. So people are sourcing. People are expecting energy prices to be high and doing whatever they can personally, to kind of lower the prices. Because you have to understand, when you’re talking about European power prices, it’s not just your solid power price. They have that almost all of their taxes on top is on top of what they actually would be paying, which is outrageous carbon, et cetera.

TN: And so I just want to go back to one point in Sam’s chart as well. I think sam, you said the storage is about 82% full or something and they’re targeting 95%, but we’re ahead in 2022 from where we were in 2021, is that right?

SR: Yeah, that is correct.

TN: Okay, so the doom and gloom that we’re hearing again, we have inflation, we definitely have shortages, but in terms of storage, we’re ahead of where we were. And we don’t expect like a mass extinction event in northern Europe because of heating or whatever, right?

SR: Correct. I think that is a good base case. That’s good for everything. No mass extinction is low bar, but yes, that’s right.

TN: Exactly. Okay, very good. Do you have anything to add on this?

Albert Marko: I’m on middle of the road here. I do agree with Sam that they’ll be okay so long as they’re okay with no manufacturing, no growth in their economy, and so on and so forth. I mean, if they tried to kick things up and the demand starts to rise, I don’t think it will be okay. I don’t think that the Russians are going to play ball, especially when they start talking about these price caps on Russian oil and gas. It’s one of those things where economically, I can understand where Sam is coming from.

Politically, I’m inclined to say that Europeans are going to screw up and just agitate the Russians. And then you start getting into this back and forth. That economic trade and price.

TN: Let’s set the price cap aside for a minute. But when you say no manufacturing, so we’ve seen some manufacturing dial back and some facilities slow down and shutter. Is that expected to continue or do we expect that to ramp back up?

AM: I expect it to completely be just stalled for the entire winter. I just think the energy prices are so astronomically high that it’s just not economical for companies to manufacture anything.

TN: Okay, so if you’re sourcing things in Germany, then you should expect supply chain issues for the next five or so months. Is that fair to say?

AM: At least six months. And this is why I keep saying that this inflation doom loop keeps recurring because as the demand rises, there’s not enough supply and then you get back into an inflationary event. What’s the inflation rate in the UK right now? Like 20% reported. 20%? And in Germany, I think it’s like 19% and rising. It doesn’t stop.

TN: And PPI is in the 30s or something. Just to play this out, I wouldn’t have a whole lot of time to cover this, but if private sector is shutting down, even parts of it, then government spending has to kick up. And if government spending is kicking up and we have an ECB that’s tightening, that’s a difficult environment for the German Finance Ministry, right? Or is it no big deal then?

SR: No, I would completely disagree. I mean, Germany is one of the few countries in the world that has they could basically print their GDP and they’d still be perfectly fine on an ability to pay basis. They spent, like, three years getting paid to have debt.

TN: So very good, because, look, nobody wants Germany to suffer, right? And if government spending

has to kick up, then great. If they’re not going to suffer as a government to be able to do that, then that’s even more fantastic, because with ECB tightening, it could create some difficult trade offs for some countries in the region, of course.

So let’s take this and park it and let’s move on to fertilizer, because, of course, that’s related to natural gas.

And we have some there’s a recent Bloomberg story about Europe’s deepening fertilizer crunch. 70% of fertilizer production is halted. And then we have a chart showing the price of nitrogen fertilizer in Germany. Obviously, it looks pretty extreme. Can we cover that, Albert, and look at the impacts of fertilizer and how that’s going to hit food going into spring or summer of next year?

AM: Oh, yeah, the fertilizer, specifically what you’re talking about, nitrogen based ones, are relying on natural gas. Natural gas prices just keep on spiking over there. And again, we can continue this whole discussion about inflationary, commodity prices, but food is a big problem. They shut down their potash.

On top of that, the farmers, they’re notorious penny pinchers, whether it’s the United States, whether it’s Europe, so on and so forth. But they’re going to have to make up the nutrients for the soil in the spring of 2023 and most likely into 2024, they can’t deprive the land of nutrients.

So, of course, they’re going to have to have another round of demand for fertilizer. I don’t know about the night gas based ones, but potash certainly will have a surge.

That’s why I’ve always on Twitter have been big on Mosaic being the 800 pound gorilla outside of Morocco’s. OCP, but OPC, I think it is. But that’s not a tradable stock mosaic fertilizer. I’m very bullish on that. That’s going to relate to bigger increases in food prices, specifically in the UK.

TN: What crops in Europe would be most impacted by this?

AM: Wheat. Most likely wheat.

TN: Yeah. Okay. And where does Germany traditionally, where does it source most of its fertilizer? Is it from Russia?

AM: I believe they get most of their stuff from Belarus originally. And I know that they have potash fertilizer plants inside of Germany itself, but I’m not sure how. I don’t know the exact numbers on the importance of what they do for a fertilizer, but it’s certainly a problem specifically for Germany. Of course it’s a problem for France. It’s even bigger problem because they’re a big food producer.

TN: Okay, Tracy, you’ve said a lot about fertilizer in the past. What are your thoughts on this? Does it just get even more intense or do we see some relief on the horizon?

TS: Well, I think it does get a little bit more intensive when we just saw And, Norway’s largest fertilizer company, all kind of curve back production in various countries wherever their plants are concerned. So it’s definitely a concern. 100% agree with Albert. Going into next year is going to be a very big problem. I mean, everybody’s harvesting right now. Everything’s fine. We’ve seen big pullback in those prices. But going forward, in particular next year, we’re going to have a problem.

AM: And a lot of that, Tracy, has to do with the national governments are going to look out for their national interests, their own farmers, so that although the imports will drop, so the exports will drop and they’ll just keep it closed within their own nation, so they can feed their own people.

TN: Fertilizer nationalism.

AM: Well, it’s just the same thing with oil. I mean, the countries are not export more than they can handle.

Yeah.

TN: Okay, so sounds pretty dire, but do we see any relief next year? Or, like you said, is it going to go into 24, or does it all depend on Russia?

AM: I think it depends on Russia whether the Europeans and the United States come to their senses and stop trying to put their foot on the throat of the Russians. You’re hampering your own economic growth, and they’re sitting there talking about, oh, we’re going to get away from fossil fuels and do this whole new climate thing. That’s just not realistic. And I don’t think they just haven’t come to grips with that yet.

TN: I think it’s a time frame thing. Right? I mean, it’s going to take some time, and I think there’s a hybrid mix in the interim that I think we’re trying to rush.

AM: Well, that’s the point. They’re trying to rush things. When you rush things, your own people are going to suffer economically and so on and so forth. It’s just not politically. They just can’t swallow it. Some of the voters don’t swallow that. Sort of stuff.

TN: And things break. Like Californians can’t charge their electric cars. Right. These are weird times.

Okay, great. Thanks, guys.

And then on the oil price cap, we had about this week, former Russian President Good about this week, saying that Russia just won’t deal with people who subscribe to the price cap.

And then we had Xavier Blossom, Bloomberg tweet about it, saying that he and his friends are going to agree to a price cap on beer at their local pub and that the guys at the pub don’t agree with it, which is a nice analogy, I guess.

Tracy, what are you seeing on the price cap? Is it actually going to come about?

TS: First, they just announced that they’ve been talking about this for months. Let me give a little bit of background. And they just now say there’s going to be three different kind of price caps, one for crude and two for refined products.

However, if you look at the actual G7 statement that was out today, they were pretty vague on it. Basically, they said, we invite all countries to provide input on the price cap design and to implement this important measure. So in other words, they’ve decided they’re going to do this, but not exactly holiday.

TN: It’s going to be 2030 before they come to an agreement on.

TS: it’s because. They’Re asking all their stakeholders to join in this. And so what I see as the problems with this right now is that there are four specific problems. One, it’s not really enforceable outside of G Seven countries if people don’t sign up for this. Two, Russia already said, again repeating you, that they won’t sell to countries that enact price caps. Three, part of this is the maritime insurance on vessels carrying Russian oil India is already providing safety and notification through IRGC class.

So by Dubai, subsidiary of the Russian shipping group. So I hope I pronounced that right. But anyway, they’ve already kind of gotten their way around this. And four, they’re also thinking about creating their own benchmark.

So right now, Russian crude oil is expressed as a discount to Brent because rent is the benchmark price. They already have an oil trading platform in place via RTS and MYsix. So they could build out this platform, which they’ve been talking about, and go through near Mir, which is basically their version of Swift, and completely by past that and just let market forces work.

I think this price cap is still way off from seeing the light of day. But this actually could turn out much more bullish because this price cap overlooks how Russia could influence global markets.

If they wanted to, they could opt to cut off the EU and NATO, not just G7. G Seven members shut production and raise global crude oil prices through the roof because they would take barrels off the market there by hurting the G7 nation.

I’m not saying that would happen. I’m just saying that’s within the realm of two box. And it’s not surprising after we just saw today, as soon as an oil price cap was announced as a plan, suddenly we just saw gas problem with Nordstream one, therefore I’m off of national gas.

TN: So what’s to stop, let’s say, a European country that signs onto a price cap from buying, let’s say, Russian crude that is sent to Chinese, say ownership and then resold to say, I don’t know, Germany. I mean, that type of circumvention is already happening, right?

TS: No, you can definitely do that. What we’re really seeing now is that kind of circumvention is happening in the product market. So it’s very easy for, say, India to buy Russian crude oil, refine it until it’s anywhere else because it’s very hard to track where those barrels really came from. It’s easier to track a resale. Right, if that makes sense.

TN: Sure it does. But they put in a barrel of, say, Emirati crude with a million barrels of Russian crude and then they label it Emirati crude. Right? Something like that.

TS: Yeah. If they both have the same API level, depends. You could mix them. If they both were the same exact API level, then you could mix them. It’s kind of different than, say, the natural gas market. Yeah.

AM: The Iranians do this with the Iraqi oil and bozzar. Often they mix it and label it As Iraqi

TS: because they share oil fields. I mean, Albert and I have been talking about this for years now.

AM: Years.

TN: Let’s be honest, the rules apply to the people who abide by the rules. Right. And so even if these price caps are put in place, there will be circumvention in a big way, of course, at least a refined product, if not crude product. And so a lot of it’s for sure. Is that fair to say?

AM: Of course, yeah. A lot of it is for show. This is a political thing right now for scapegoating Russia

for inflation problems. Now they’re just snowballing things and saying Russia’s gas is the problem

for inflation, Russia’s oil is the inflation problem, and other caps. But like I said earlier, and even just Tracy reaffirmed it’s like the moment you mentioned price caps against Russia, Moscow finds an issue, whether it’s gas, prom leak or Belarus problems, or Algeria has problems with Wagner. They create these issues all the time.

TN: Of course, anytime there are sanctions on a country, right. These things happen. Okay, very good. Thank you, guys. We spent a lot of time talking about Europe. So let’s move on to the week ahead and

what we expect to happen the week ahead.

We saw some really interesting action in markets, and last week we talked about how Palo speech, we really should have been a surprise to no one, but markets seem to kind of take it on the chin this week, acting shocked that he repeated himself again. So what do we expect going into next week? Do we expect things to kind of moderate a little bit or do we at least in equity markets, do we still expect some downward movement and also, say energy markets? We saw crude down, I think at 86 or something.

Tracy, do you expect, say, energy markets to continue to fall next week?

TS: What I would really look at, and what I’m looking at more, instead of looking at just reprice, which seems highly manipulated right now, especially going into midterms, not suggesting anything, but I think what I would start looking at is in like second and third month spreads or fourth month spreads. Right. So you really want to be looking, I think, just a couple of months down that curve a little bit. And if you start seeing because those curves are still kind of telling us that the market is very tight and curves, you can’t really manipulate as much as you can somewhat of the front line. So I think that’s where you should be looking at. I think we’ll really get a better grasp on these markets and to see what front market is next week is OPEC meeting, right. So they were talking about cuts, right, over the last couple of weeks. That’s right. That’s all. I will be on that. That’s on the fifth.

TN: And SPR keeps going until October. So we’re only looking at November,December before we’ll see some upward pressure on prices. At least a stand up pressure.

TS: Yeah, exactly. And depending on what OPEC says, we could see an initial pull back. The general consensus is they’re not going to do anything in September. However, OPEC has been known

to give us some surprises. So just keep that in mind.

TN: That’s good all right. Very good. Sam, what are you looking for for next week?

SR: Next week I’m looking at the ECB. I want to hear how hawkish they are and how quick they’re going to go and what type of language they’re using. They’re still in the QE boat, right? They’re still buying Italy, they’re still buying Spain, they’re still buying a bunch of the southern debt periphery type debt.

So I want to hear what they’re saying, how they’re saying it, and just how call it, quote, unquote, inflation-oriented. They are. They probably should be particularly versus the bank of England, who is very hawkish and likely to continue to, one, explore actually outright sales from their asset purchases to shrink their balance sheet and how quickly the relative moves are there.

I think that can create some fireworks, particularly called the Euro pound type crossed I think that could be really interesting and cross asset class could be.

TN: Do you think you should be able to surprise hawkish?

SR: Yes.

TN: You do? Okay, interesting. That would be very interesting to see. Wow. Okay. And so you think the Euro recovers a little bit on that?

SR: I think it knee jerks, yes. But the question is how long does that last? Right. That, I think, is a much more important question than the initial knee jerk. And I think over time, it would be a fade the news move.

TN: Okay, very interesting. Okay, very good. Thanks for that, Albert, close this out. What do you see for next week?

AM: The big boys come back to play from vacation. That’s right, they do. I think they’re going to start holding the market a little bit more accountable for all this bad data. And I think earnings were just atrocious when you look at what inflation was. I’m actually going to be watching though

China as we get closer to the CCP, the Party meeting, I think it’s October 16, I think XI might start announcing many stimulus packages in certain sectors. So I want to see if those materialize and what that does with commodities that are attached to them.

TN: Okay. I just want to say, with regard to the Party meeting in November, if anybody talks about reading tea leaves or any of that garbage, you’re banned immediately. Okay.

So we’re not going to imply, like, cultural mysteriousness on Chinese political processes. It’s just they’re a bureaucracy like everyone else. They make decisions like everyone else. They’re no more or less mysterious than anyone else. So I would say that for the people watching, because the people watching are going to see a lot of kind of China experts or whatever China watchers talked about how mysterious the CCP is and a lot of question marks. A lot of them are Fed talking points from the CCP spin machine. So they’re not mysterious, they’re a bureaucracy. They’re boring, just like every other country.

AM: Yeah. And the Party is I believe that Congress is October 16, not November. Yeah. So it’s closer than people realize. It’s only 30 days away, but China is going to have to probably stimulate some sectors associated with whoever is in line with the party leadership to keep them happy. So that’s what I’ll be watching next week.

TN: Yes. Very good, guys. Thank you so much. Looking forward to have a great holiday weekend, and I look forward to seeing you next week. Thank you very much.

Week Ahead

The Week Ahead – 11 Jul 2022: Energy Backwardation

Post author By admin
Post date July 9, 2022

We had a pretty volatile week last week, with crude selling off pretty sharply early in the week. In this episode, we looked at energy backwardation, and Tracy educated us on what’s happening in those markets.

We also had some comments from Putin about a multipolar world. Albert talked through that.

And then on Friday, unfortunately, we saw the assassination of Japan’s former Prime Minister Abe. We talked about the Japan post-Abe and what that means for the region.

Key themes:

Energy backwardation
Putin’s Multi-Polar world
Japan post-Abe
What’s ahead for next week?

This is the 25th episode of The Week Ahead, where experts talk about the week that just happened and what will most likely happen in the coming week.

Follow The Week Ahead experts on Twitter:

Tony: https://twitter.com/TonyNashNerd
Tracy: https://twitter.com/chigrl
Albert: https://twitter.com/amlivemon/

Time Stamps

0:00 Start
0:54 Key Themes for the week
1:28 Catalyst of the energy sell-off on Tuesday
5:44 Will we see more action in energy prices?
6:57 Is it cost-ineffective to make hydrogen with natgas prices?
8:11 Diesel
9:20 Vladimir Putin’s multipolar world.
13:44 Japan post-Abe
20:29 What’s for the week ahead?

Listen to the podcast version on Spotify here:

Transcript

TN: Hi. Welcome to the Week Ahead. I’m Tony Nash. Thanks for joining us. I’m with Tracy and Albert today. Sam is away, but we are talking about a pretty volatile week this week. Before we get started, actually, please like and subscribe. Please ask any questions below, make any comments. We want to make sure this is interesting for you, so just let us know any additional info you want or comments. We’re happy to address those.

We had a pretty volatile week this week with crude selling off pretty sharply early in the week. So we’re going to look at energy backwardation, and Tracy is going to educate us all on what’s happening in those markets. We also had some comments out of Putin about a multipolar world. We’re going to have Albert talk through that. And then on Friday, unfortunately, we saw the assassination of Japan’s former Prime Minister Abe. So we’re going to talk about the Japan post Abe and what that means for Japan and the region.

So first let’s get into energy. Tracy, obviously, we had a big sell off in energy early in the week, and then we saw it come back later. What was really the catalyst for that energy sell off on Tuesday?

TS: What happened is that we started on July 5, right? We opened with low liquidity in the market in general. Then we saw a sell off in the general markets and commodities and risky assets that kind of exacerbated that trade. And then on the 6th, we saw a liquidation of a couple of very large positions in that market. And so fundamentally, basically, there is no reason for this sell off other than technicalities.

In fact, if we’re looking at this market, this spreads, the calendar spreads, which means month to month, were exploding higher during this entire move. That implies that the physical market at least, is very tight right now because you’re seeing backwardation increase significantly when we’re seeing a $10 move in ZZ, which is crazy.

TN: Can you tell us what that means? A $10 move in ZZ. What does that mean for the rest of us?

TS: If you’re talking about calendar schedule, we’re talking about monthly. So we can talk about the current front month is August. So we look at August, September, September to October, October to November, et cetera, et cetera. And once these spreads start exploding higher, that means that we’re seeing people want to dump oil in the front month market because that’s more lucrative than keeping it in storage.

So if I’m an investor and I’m looking and I want to invest in a backwardated market, I’m looking at a convex market that goes from right to left, and I’m going to invest in, say, a back month, and I want my investment to move higher…

TN: I’m investing further in the future.

TS: Right. That’s what it backwards. If you’re in a contangable market, we’re looking at the opposite situation, where you’re looking at a convex structure going from right to left, whereas if I invest in December, by the time my investment reaches Frontline X free, I’m losing money. I’m losing value in my investment.

TN: Right.

TS: And so that’s how we kind of have to look at that situation.

TN: Yes. You had a great tweet this week explaining that with visuals.

TS: I did. It’s on Twitter, if anyone wants to see it.

TN: Exactly. We saw this in crude. We also saw it in a natural gas. Right?

TS: Yes. We’re kind of seeing a major pullback in many of the commodities markets. Right. We’re seeing a little bit of a bounce this week because we’re looking at China. China has recently announced we have one last announcement with $200 billion bond sale rate. So we’re looking at a lot of stimulus out of China that’s giving commodities the boost. Right now, we have to see I think the markets are still going to wait on, particularly the industrial and base medical markets are going to wait until we actually see some action in China to really see investment back into these markets after this huge goal.

TN: So nobody believes the China stimulus story right now. It’s kind of a show me the money period. Right. But once they do start to show the money, do you think we’ll see much more action in energy prices?

TS: I think you’ll see more action in metal prices than you will equity prices.

TN: Copper’s way off compared to, say, the last 18 months. But it’s not way off, given historical copper prices. If we go back before, say, Q1 of 2020, it’s kind of where it had been previously in the ballpark, at least. Right. So we haven’t necessarily reverted back to pre-COVID, necessarily. We’re just in the start-stop manufacturing world, and that’s what’s affecting base metals like copper. Is that fair to say?

TS: Oh, absolutely. If you look at, like, a monthly chart rather than looking at a five-minute chart, and the market has kind of just been consolidating, really, for the last two years, until we see a really big break above, say, $5, a really big break below $3, we’re still kind of in that consolidation zone.

TN: 3.50 to 4.50 kind of range. Interesting. Okay. Sorry, Albert.

AM: Yeah. I got a question for Tracy. Nat gas, as we’re talking, since we discussed it a little bit, that’s used to make hydrogen, if I’m not mistaken, and since the nat gas price seems to be elevated, isn’t that going to be a little bit too cost-ineffective to make hydrogen, which causes a diesel problem, if I’m not mistaken? I’m not sure about that. That’s what I’m asking.

TS: No, absolutely. I think that would be a problem. Looking forward. I think there’s a lot of problems if we’re looking at the hydrogen market. There’s still a lot of problems when we’re talking about taking this idea to actual fruition. Right. Because if you look at the hydrogen market, there’s like a rainbow of green hydrogen, blue hydrogen, this hydrogen, this hydrogen. But we really haven’t gotten to the point that can overtake, not gas the allure of the situation is that you can take hydrogen, mix it with nat gas, you can send it down the same pipeline, and that saves a lot of money.

AM: Yeah.

TS: The situation is this is not a great idea in theory, but we’re just not there yet.

TN: Okay, got you. Albert’s, question about diesel. Diesel is not any less tight than it was a week or two ago. Right? In fact, that’s just as tight or tighter than it was, say, a couple of weeks ago or a month ago.

TS: Yeah, I think the diesel market is still very tight.

TN: Right.

AM: Maintenance season starts, isn’t it? From September to November?

TS: Yes, we will start maintenance seasons.

TN: Okay.

TS: I would actually look for some of these refineries to maybe put off maintenance season. So that’s what I would watch to the maintenance season happen. And it’s happened before. If we have it such a tight market, we could see them putting off maintenance seasons. It’s not unheard of.

TN: Okay, so hurricane season and maintenance season are upon us, but we may see at least maintenance season for all of us.

TS: Oh, not I just moved to Florida.

TN: Good luck with that. I’m in Texas. We don’t get as many of you, but it’ll be a fun season for you.

Okay, let’s move on, guys, to some comments out of Putin this week. Vladimir Putin had some comments about us, the multipolar world becoming more and more of reality. We heard this ten years ago. We heard this 20 years ago, and it came up again this week. So, Albert, can you kind of let us know what’s going on there?

AM: Tony, I’ve used this multipolar example for the US. Dollar dominance I got for years now. And the fact of the matter is, we are not in a multipolar world. We are not even going into multipolar world.

People are confusing a little bit of weakness in the US. Leadership and errors and decision making, foreign policy for multipolars, it’s just a multipolarity, and it’s just not the case for the world to be in a multipolar scenario, you would need multiple countries with equal militaries and economies. We are nowhere near that.

The Russian economy is 2.5 trillion. The American economy is pushing 30 trillion. This is just a joke by Vladimir Putin. Simply undermine the US dominance both in the world stage and the dollar.

TN: Aside from some dumpster pundits who write for The Atlantic or whatever, who believes that nonsense?

AM: A lot of Europhiles that want to see the United States take a step down, they can do it. A lot of crypto guys, a lot of gold guys. These guys have to make that argument, because without multipolarity, you cannot have a neutral reserve asset to settle trade. And that’s just the fact of the matter.

The problem becomes, if you have a multipolar world, you’re on the verge of another world war, because there always has to be one alpha that takes hold of the system. You just can’t have equal people.

TN: And the cost of the transaction? Cost? The cost of trade, everything goes up. If you have multiple rights go up, everything goes up.

AM: It’s completely unstable.

TS: Inflation from other countries to other countries.

AM: Yeah.

TN: The world is built on China exporting deflation. Has been for 15, 20 years. And it will continue. If they could just keep their ports open, it will continue. And it makes people happy. Right.

AM: No, you’re right. That’s just the way our system works right now, with the dollar underpinning all of it. It’s the lifeblood that makes trade work. And people are not going to like it. But I promise you, no one alive today is going to see anything other.

TN: So let me just take a step back. Who does he think the polls are? Russia, China and the US? Or Germany or something?

AM: He’s trying to make an assumption to say that Russia and China are the new contenders to the United States. The problem with that is they don’t have military power projection globally like the United States does. They can’t even invade Ukraine. China can’t even invade Taiwan. Otherwise they would have taken it if they’ve it could have. This is the world we live.

TN: Yeah. Russia can stir up problems in Libya or the Middle East or whatever.

AM: There’s no question that they can stir up problems and they can fill in gap vacuums that we leave right, unintentionally, unintentionally. But they cannot hold that territory. They cannot force changes in governments like the United States did.

TN: And every time I hear somebody talk about the Belt and Road as a sign of China’s dominance, it reminds me of Napoleon’s march to Russia. Right? I mean, they’re spreading themselves so thin. They can’t keep that up.

AM: They can’t. That’s perfect example to do that, to make that thing actually successful, you need to back that up to secure your trade line, trade with the military. Right. China has like, what, two military bases outside of China? Like one in Djibouti and something else. I mean, they can’t send ships over to their armor.

TN: Myanmar.

AM: Yeah. This is beyond a joke to me. I don’t take anybody seriously that even brings this part up, right. Vladimir Putin included.

TN: That’s good. So anybody watching this, if you have an alternative view, let us know in the comments. Honestly, we’d love to hear it. We just want to hear some credible.

TS: Put your notes in the comments.

TN: Yes, absolutely. Okay. Now, finally today I woke up in the US to the really tragic news of Japan’s foreign Prime Minister Abe, being assassinated.

I saw Abe in his first stint as PM in the mid 2000s. And then when he came back in, in 2013, and with the Abenomics plan, which was really difficult to pull off, ultimately successfully. The guy was smart. He was all about Japan. He’s all about Japan recovering, all about Japan being competitive. I put a picture up of Abe shaking hands with Prime Minister Modi of India. Japan and India were very tight. A lot of Japanese investment going to India, a lot of partnership across those two countries and in Africa, both to defend against China in Asia and other parts of the world. So Prime Minister Abe will be missed.

I think what Abe did partly was bring back Japan’s ability to defend itself by passing a constitutional change that allowed the Japanese military to defend itself where previously it wasn’t even allowed to do that. So there’s a lot of dignity that Japan kind of got back, and we can rub Japan’s nose in World War II for eternity, but it’s not going to be constructive. What happened, happened. They’ve paid their dues, and that’s kind of what Abe said, look, we paid our dues, we’re going to move on now and join the 21st century. And that’s what Japan did.

So I’m just curious to get your thoughts, guys, on Japan post Abe. What do you see as of course they moved on to another prime minister. Japan has already moved on from the Abe government. He wasn’t a sitting prime minister. But what do you see kind of the challenges of Japan’s role in Asia particularly, but also in the world post Abe?

AM: I think the most pressing issue for Japan would be contending with China, both militarily and economically. Abe was, like you said, brilliant statesman and patriot for the Japanese people. So he’s going to be sorely missed. And it’s not just he’s going to be missed, but his cabinet and the people that his network is going to be missed because they’re losing a big part of what he brought to the table in terms of strategy and ideology. It was a big shift.

I think that the Japanese are probably going to struggle for strategy in the next five to ten years. And it’s a sad thing, but I’m sure the Japanese, they’re resilient people and they’ll move on and they’ll recover.

TN: Tracy?

TS: No, I absolutely agree with what Albert said. I think the thing is that people are painting him, the media right now, in particular the Western media, painting them with some villain, which is very interesting to me. And I think that people should really just look at his legacy and respect what he’s done instead of jumping on the bandwagon.

TN: So they’re portraying him as some ultra nationalist, but he’s as ultra nationalist as Modi as in India, or Jokowi is in Indonesia, or Lee is in Singapore, you name it. Tsai Ing-wen in Taiwan. It’s an Asian direction now. Right. And has been for the last ten to 15 years.

AM: Yeah. The media also, Tony, is desperate to not allow any center right or even right nationalist figures be murderers or looked up upon. They just can’t stomach it. They just can’t help themselves to demonize a person that is absolutely unjustifiably demonized by being called an ultra-nationalist and even worse, by the NPR.

NPR had two other headlines that they had to delete because it was just so atrocious. This is a.. And Modi, Abe, I don’t want to put Victor Orban into that, but all these right leaning leaders just get attacked and the media can’t help it.

TN: Right, yeah. I think from an economic plan, if we look at what Abe did with Abenomics, of course, the Japanese Central Bank is kind of “independent,” right. But they really took the JPY from kind of 76 to the dollar to, say, 120 to the dollar, and it really allowed Japanese manufacturing to be competitive again. Right.

And it took somebody with that clarity of economic vision, as well as the clarity of, say, the military vision and political vision, to be able to pull off what they did. And in terms of, say, energy sustainability under Abe, they also created much deeper relationships in the Middle East with places like Qatar, UAE.

TS: And they also looked forward to nuclear, where you looked at the west was looking to shut things down, Abe was looking to invest in nuclear projects. You’re looking for energy security, energy going forward. There are a lot of things that he did to advance that sector in Japan, which is admirable.

TN: Right. Albert if we take a US perspective on this? The US has worked hard to kind of hold a line against China. Do you think with the mediocre leadership we have in the US right now, do you think it’s possible that some of that US say coalition falls apart a little bit? Or do you think we just kind of take a breather and then it resumes based on the institutional stamina of parts of the Japanese government?

AM: That’s a great question, Tony. That’s actually a really good question. And I think where we have to look for we have to separate the Biden foreign policy cabinet with the Pentagon. Because the Pentagon is actually leading this charge for the Pacific with Japan and Australia in charge. I really don’t think that the Japanese are going to take a step back or the US is going to take a step back. I think the system is pretty much, the train has already left the station and it’s rolling.

There might be an argument from the opposition in Japan, but I don’t think. That it’s going to take hold to derail this new initiative by the US and the Pacific.

TN: Great, that’s good to hear. Okay, guys. Hey, on that somber note, we’ll end it, but let’s look at the week ahead. Guys, what are you looking for in the week ahead? We’ve had this real turnaround this week. What do you see going into next week? Do you see things calming a bit?

We saw it coming into Friday. Things really turn up in US markets and in commodity markets. Do we see things stabilizing a bit going into the Fed meeting after we’ve had some Fed comments late this week?

AM: I want to see the comments of where they might signal a 50 basis point rate hike versus a 75. I absolutely believe 75 points is coming just from the jobs data that they posted. It was obviously massaged a little bit.

TN: Just a little bit.

AM: Of course it is. Yeah, but this was a good one. And then the revision too, and it just seems to me that they want another 75 basis point rate hike.

TN: To really kill it?

AM: They got to tackle inflation. I mean, they’re looking at 8.8 on the next CPI, which is just.. And you’re staring on the barrel at 9% and 9.2 and 9.3 in the coming months, which is absolutely a political nuclear bomb that goes off.

TN: Okay, Tracy, what are you looking for in the next week especially in commodities?

TS: Yeah, I mean, I agree we probably will see 75 after non farm payroll this week, which I was looking for a clue kind of are we going to get 50, are we going to get 75? It looks like 75 for sure.

So looking in the coming weeks, I’m really looking to China right now and to see what comes to fruition with these sort of stimulus plans. What does that do to the base in industrial medals markets? And I think those are the two things that you should be focusing on right now, particularly if you’re invested in commodities markets.

TN: Very good. Okay. Yeah. I’m kind of hoping they give in to 50, but I’m not hopeful. I do think they’ll on the kind of conservative hawkish side and go 75. But if they can pick up the bat phone and talk to China, and the China guys will unload a dump truck of cash over the next week or so, then I think they’ll be a little bit lighter and do 50 basis points. But I think a lot of it depends on China ECB. They can’t get their act together, so there’s nothing ECB can do to really help.

And Europe is in so much trouble that it doesn’t really matter what they do. They have huge problems anyway. So. I think you’re right. And tell me what you think about this. But I don’t necessarily think we see massive chop. I think we see just a lot of fairly sideways moved for the next week or so.

AM: I would be wary if we jumped up to 4000 or even, like, 3970. I think a rug pull would be in an order right after that. That’s what they do. They bowl everybody up and then pull the rug out.

TN: Tracy?

TS: Yeah. After this big move down in the oil market, in particular, because we did have sort of a flow event coupled with a couple of large funds kind of workforce to liquidate. So I could see that we still could go a little bit higher next week. Sideways to higher next week.

TN: Very good. Okay, guys, be interesting to see. Thanks for joining us. Thanks very much. Have a great weekend. And have a great week ahead.

TN: Very good. Thank you, guys.

AM: I struggle with the headache through that whole thing.

QuickHit

EM Meltdown: China, Turkey & Russia (Part 2)

Post author By admin
Post date October 26, 2021

In this second part, emerging markets expert Michael Nicoletos discussed Turkey and Russia. What are the major issues that Turkey is facing, specially around its FX reserves? They have an energy problem as well, and will soon need to choose between the US and Russia. And how about Russia’s love-hate relationship with Europe? How does Nicoletos see it will end up?

Please watch Part 1 first, if you have not already. Michael talked about China’s household debt and how much is that? Can they ever recover from the Evergrande disaster? And how they got into it in the first place? Is CNY still valuable? How do the Chinese get dollars now with their very limited FX reserve? Should you use the digital Yuan? How much is China spending right now to up its GDP?

Michael Nicoletos have spent most of his life around markets, and I used to run a hedge fund for more than 10 years on emerging markets. He shut it down in 2019 to take a sabbatical and Covid 19 hit the world. Now, he is doing a lot of research on emerging markets and trying to see what the next steps will be in terms of the investment world. But in the meantime, he is also advising a few firms on their investment.

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This QuickHit episode was recorded on October 20, 2021.

The views and opinions expressed in this EM Meltdown: China, Turkey and Russia (Part 1) Quickhit episode are those of the guest and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of Complete Intelligence. Any contents provided by our guest are of their opinion and are not intended to malign any political party, religion, ethnic group, club, organization, company, individual or anyone or anything.

Show Notes

TN: Talking about EMs, and we talked about reserves, and you mentioned Turkey. Let’s talk about Turkey for a minute because you’ve made some really interesting statements about Turkey, and I’d like to really understand your perspective.

MN: Turkey faces some other issues. Turkey faces high inflation. More than 20% rates are around 19% of negative yields. The Lira has fallen more than 50% in the past few years. So you might see nominal GDP in Turkish Lira going up. But if you put it in dollar terms, it’s actually flat for the last ten years. It’s not flat, it’s flat-ish. So in Turkish Lira, the last ten years, the Turkish GDP has gone up 350%, which is a wow. But if you put it in dollars, it’s not flat, but it’s not something meaningful.

Now, if you look at Turkey and the devaluation, the President of Turkey, Tayyip Erdoğan, has tried to stop the Lira from falling. Right now, it’s I think at its all-time lows around 920 versus a dollar. But if you look at the FX reserve, which is very tricky and this is very interesting for Turkey, you’ll see that, okay, the number is ambiguous because depending on what source you see, you’re going to see another number. But let’s say it’s around $18 billion. Now, this is the gross number. If we deduct gold and all the other stuff and we also deduct the swap lines, and I will explain what the swap line is, this number falls around to $20 billion. And this could be negative according to some sources because the dollars are not there.

What has Turkey done? Instead of using its dollars to protect the Lira from falling, I’m not an advocate that you should do that, but that’s what they’ve been doing. They went to the banks and did swap lines with the banks. And the banks are using depositors dollars to buy back the Lira. So depositors right now don’t actually have those dollars in their account.

MN: Because the Turkish banks have made agreements with the central bank with swap lines, which okay, when your central bank gives you a swap line, it’s a guarantee if you’re a bank. And instead of, if you go and you see the headline number of the Turkey central bank, you won’t see it falling. But if you understand that they’ve been using depositors’ dollars to cover for it, you need to subtract that. So the number could be close to 20, maybe there are some allegations that it could even be negative. So if it’s negative, imagine. FX reserves in Turkey are pretty horrible.

You have, let’s say, $18 billion of gross FX reserve, and you have $130 billion of short term liabilities, within the next twelve months, Turkey has 130 billion of foreign claims. So again, this metric is not really good. Now, Turkey is estimated to grow around 8 or 9% this year. Again in Turkish Lira.

MN: If we take the Lira is down 25% this year. So this is an issue. Another issue is in Turkey, 60% of its current account is energy. They don’t have domestic energy, so they need to import energy and we know what’s been going on with the energy crisis and natural gas and oil going higher. So all these are main problems for Turkey right now, which I think will be forced to find a drastic way to… They don’t want to go to the IMF or the World Bank, but I think at some point they’ll have to go. And again here geopolitics come to play why they say geopolitics is because Turkey is in NATO. It’s the second biggest force in NATO. The US wants to keep it in NATO because wherever US doesn’t send military, Turkey does. Not many NATO allies send military forces wherever they go.

So Turkey is trying to play both sides right now. Trying to be the good guy with Russia, good guy with NATO. Trying to get the most out of both sides. But I think time is ticking and they will be forced to take some form of decision on what they want to do in the future because they’re running out of time in terms of their FX reserves.

TN: Yeah, it sounds like it’s pretty short time. Wow. Okay. So looking at the energy issues, not just what Turkey faces, but that Europe faces, I want to spend a little bit of time talking about the Russia-Europe relationship and what you’re seeing there. Will Russia provide sufficient gas to Europe this winter? And, from a financial perspective, how much will Russia benefit from that? Just generally.

MN: Yeah. Okay. But the thing is here the following: Europe trying to transition to a more green related economy. The planning was pretty horrible. I would say they wanted to do it fast and they wanted to say “blackmail” corporations to go to more green energy. What did they do then? They created the CO2 emissions credits. So if you were polluting above a level, you were forced to buy CO2 credits in order to cover for that. And that was like an indirect tax, making it less efficient for corporations to use that form of energy so they would be forced to go to other forms of energy.

Now, from going to coal to, let’s say, totally green. It takes some time to create the wind turbines and the sun. And actually Germany shut down all its nuclear reactors because of Fukushima.

TN: They have a lot of low-end Taiwanese fabs transition to photovoltaics with all of the incentives they were providing. I mean, for a long time, low-end fabs across Asia were just doing a very quick transition to a PV, and it was just a kind of back up the truck moment where they were just taking all the dollars they earned or Euros or whatever currency they could because Germany and all these other places were incentivizing them to do it. And they were low-end PVs. They weren’t high-end. They were just bog standard photovoltaics.

MN: No, no. Okay, but besides that, what did the European Commission do? There are auctions every now and then of CO2 credits. But the auctions are arbitrary. So the Commission, whenever it wanted the prices to go up, they did not do the auctions. So then the supply of credits was less and less. CO2 credit emissions went through the roof. So suddenly, if you use natural gas as an energy, it went even higher. And this created the viscious loop, creating the natural gas prices to go even higher.

In the meantime, Europe was negotiating with Russia about Nordstream, too. So Russia, which is a pretty good strategic and geopolitical player, realized that Europe was going back as being back in the corner and said, unless you sign whatever I want, let me put it in layman’s terms. I’m not going to pump anymore natural gas. Europe says, no, we have to sit down. We have to discuss. Okay, I’m not pumping. So one brings to another. And every time that Europe trying to play hardball, Russia says, okay, there’s no such a problem. I’m not going to be pumping and prices go higher and higher.

So I guess that at some point Europe will need to sign anything Russia wants at this moment. And will try to negotiate some form of an agreement which will be obviously not, it won’t be good. But it will be much better than the current prices that we’re seeing now. And because of the energy prices going higher, Russia is benefiting on a macro level, benefiting on a geopolitical level, and it’s gaining a lot of strength in the region.

TN: Hugely. Yeah. Hugely.

MN: So the two are interconnected. It’s not one or the other. So the energy crisis has helped Russia, and Russia has exploited Europe’s inability to act smoothly and fast.

TN: It’s very interesting. Okay. Just to close this out because I know we’ve been going on for a while. I’m just curious about Russia’s position with Europe, say, over the medium term. Do you see Russia and Europe growing closer? Do you see that relationship becoming tighter, or do you see that eventually becoming an antagonistic relationship? Are there substitutional energy sources that Europe can utilize and that eventually becomes an antagonistic relationship again? Just in general terms. I don’t necessarily political specifics. But how do you think that plays out?

MN: Well, I’ll use Henry Kissinger’s famous quote that was back, like 40 years ago. He said, “When I called Europe, who do I call?” So right now, you have, in Germany you just had elections. They haven’t formed the government. It might take months before they form a government.

In France, there are elections in April. It seems that the right could be a threat to Macron. And we don’t know what the “right’ means in France. It could be Le Pen or it could be someone else, but it could be anything right now. So right now, I don’t see a leader. If Macron wins, he could be the next leader of Europe. But right now, there’s a leadership problem within Europe.

So as long as there’s a leadership problem within Europe, in my view, there’s a vacuum. And I think Russia will exploit it to gate as much influence as it can. And I cannot foresee the future. But in the next six to eight months, I think Russia will try and get as much influence as it can and try to exploit that vacuum.

TN: I think you’re right. They’re very smart. They’re very smart political players.

QuickHit

OPEC+, JCPOA & Delta Variant: Strength or weakness for oil & gas prices?

Post author By admin
Post date July 19, 2021

Energy commodities experts Tracy Shuchart and Sam Madani joined forces in this special #QuickHit episode to talk about crude, OPEC+, JCPOA, and how lockdowns will affect the market this year. Most importantly, how investors should plan?

Tracy writes for a Hedge Fund Telemetry, where she is the energy and material strategist. She also manages an energy and materials portfolio for a family office. Meanwhile, Samir Madani is the co-founder of TankerTrackers.com. They’re an online service that keeps track of oil that’s being shipped around the world. His specialty is the tricky tankers, the ones that like to play according to the rules.

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This QuickHit episode was recorded on July 17, 2021.

The views and opinions expressed in this OPEC+, JCPOA & Delta Variant: Strength or weakness for oil & gas prices? QuickHit episode are those of the guest and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of Complete Intelligence. Any contents provided by our guest are of their opinion and are not intended to malign any political party, religion, ethnic group, club, organization, company, individual or anyone or anything.

Show Notes

TN: We’ve seen kind of an uplifting crude prices. We’ve seen things like copper prices come down, natural gas prices really start to see some upward pressure recently. At the same time, we’re seeing talk about the JCPOA and some other Middle East type of changes with OPEC+ and UAE and Saudi. What’s your thoughts on the crude and natural gas markets? We can talk about commodities generally.I know that’s a big, wide open question. Tracy, do you want to give us generally your view and some of your positioning at the moment?

TS: Well, I’m very bullish on commodities, particularly industrial metals, base metals and minerals needed for this energy transition. So copper and things of that nature.

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We have seen a little bit of a pullback in a lot of commodities, which is not surprising. We had such a large move up. However, everybody’s looking at this as a group like the CRB index rate has pulled back. But if you look at individual commodities, you’re still seeing iron ore still at highs. So it’s not like a whole commodity collapse. You’re still seeing strength in a lot of different areas.

So my positioning is instead of index, I’m positioned in individual stocks and particularly on the minor side, because minors are going to have the same capex problem that oil is having.

TN: OK, that’s a great point. Sam, what’s your view like generally with with energy?

SM: I remain bullish when it comes to oil in particular, and I pat myself on the back for having gone long in at the end of March last year, when the the mutual funds were at the all time lowest in regards to oil. And that’s come up quite a lot since then.

I do believe that we will probably find a good footholding now in the 70s. And in order for that to remain, I think something drastic is going to have to happen on the upward probably scathe $100 and come back down so that the OPEC can look like the good guys in the mid 70s. So I think also because of the fact that there’s a capex shortage in the oil sector, they need this revenue to come in order to sustain production as well.

My original intended investment horizon was around three to four years. I’m going to be cutting that short until September of next year because the issue that we have now is that the lockdowns are still in effect in many areas, but also when it comes to Europe where I’m situated, most of the inoculations have only gone through the first phase. So we’re still waiting for the second shot and therefore this summer will be delayed. We’re not going to be traveling everywhere like we were in 2019. Instead, that will happen most likely next summer.

There’s still one big run up towards the three-digit oil price and that would be most likely to happen next year rather than now.

This is CI Futures July forecast for COMEX Copper this YTD.

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TN: So you brought up OPEC. There’s been news this week around OPEC+ and a deal with Saudi and UAE and some other Middle East dynamics. What’s your view on that? How much downward pressure will that put on crude markets?

TS: Because of those factors in the Middle East, because I am of a belief we will see a deal and we will get some more barrels on the market, the market is actually very tight right now. But we’re also having lockdowns in some places in Asia. So right now, we already are seeing a pullback in crude. Until we get a little bit more certain that 65-75 range will probably hold us for a while, I see some consolidation there and after $115 move from the lows last year, it makes sense for oil to chill out, consolidate here a little bit.

TN: Sam, what’s your view on the kind of OPEC+, Saudi, UAE and other kind of OPEC countries wanting to tag along on the UAE?

SM: I think one issue that they themselves want to know is status of the JCPOA. They really want to know how much of an issue Iran would be if their balance come back to market. Now, that’s a big if.

But if we look at what happened during the Trump administration, the United States pulled out of the deal and that was not good optics for the U.S. side. But now what’s happened is that Iran is not complying with the deal. So the ball is now in their court instead. So the Biden administration is saying, yes, the United States wants to be part of the deal, even though it’s not a very popular deal in the US. I don’t see any popular support for it. It’s more of a let’s just get back in there so Iran can improve its compliance. But they’re not improving their compliance. Instead, what they’re doing is going the other direction and they’re increasing their enrichment. They’re becoming more brazen about how they move around the world with Navy vessels and so on.

And now, of course, there’s an Iranian president that’s going to take office in August. So I think the deal will play fall apart instead because of the fact that Iran is not complying.

TN: If the deal falls apart, does that chaos help oil prices, meaning rise or does it create the perception that there will be a dramatically larger supply in the market?

SM: I think the initial reaction will be that, “Oh, these barrels are not going to be reentering the market, therefore the price will go higher.” So that’s the first automated response. But then, you know, the dust will begin to settle after a while when there’s an understanding of what kind of barrels are not entering the market.

So in Iran’s case, they are shipping sour crude. Whether it’s light or heavy, it’s sour. In order for that oil to become sweet, which is more attractive, you have to de-sulfur the oil. And so Iran, what they do is they give you a discount if you want to buy light sweet oil, but then they’re buying like sour oil. Iran gives $10 discount, for instance, and then they just remove the sulfur at the refinery at their own expense. And that’s what’s causing, for instance, West Africa to lower their exports. So moving out a lot less oil now out of Africa than before on account of China buying more Iranian oil instead.

TS: I think what people forget, there’s already a lot of Iranian oil on the market. So even if they came back at production of 4 to 4.5 million, it’s not really a lot of extra added barrels that are not already on the market.

SM: Exactly. And it will be absorbed by the demand that’s coming of course.

TN: But it seems to me the kind of perception of legitimacy that would come through JCPOA may calm prices down a bit through the kind of perception of legitimacy of that supply?

TS: Yeah. I mean, if it came to fruition, which I don’t foresee it, I have to agree with Sam on this point. But yeah, the market would think, oh, OK, we have all these barrels coming on even though there isn’t, and that it would be a numbers game from there, then you’d have to see supply and demand numbers from the various agencies monthly reports.

SM: And the thing also does not happen overnight. So even if the process of JCPOA happens and Biden finally signs, for instance, initially a waiver, the whole process takes forever to reboot again. We saw it last time. Remember Tracy back in years ago, it took many months.

And also in the case of Iran, most of their domestic national fleet is tied up containing gas condensate. So they have around 70 million barrels of gas condensates floating. And that used up nearly all of the VLCC supertankers, the ones that can carry two million barrels. So what Iran has done is they put additional vessels, vintage VLCC. So now they have 200 vessels as opposed to 70. And those are the ones, the foreign flagged vessels that are moving the oil mostly to China.

TN: You both mentioned lockdowns earlier in the conversation. And I think the tone here is that we have a pretty strong basis for rising crude prices. But we’ve seen some moves over the last week in the Netherlands and California and other places for maybe not full lockdowns, but more severe compliance with masks and other things and that seems to be leading toward potentially some lockdowns. First of all, if there are lockdowns coming, what would be driving that? And we all know about the Delta variant and stuff. But are there political factors that would be driving that? Second of all, if there were, how would that impact the six to nine month view of crude markets for you guys?

TS: The United States is so big, I don’t believe that they’re going to lock down the whole country again. It just won’t happen. You would literally have riots on the streets in some places. So I don’t foresee that happening. I could see some of the states like California just reinstated their mask mandates. I’ve been watching those states that kind of had more severe lockdowns to begin with like Michigan. If they’d lockdown again in the fall, that would probably be more politically motivated, but we’ll have to see what the numbers are and whatnot.

As far as my crude view, I’m very bullish on crude. But that doesn’t mean like I’m expecting a $100 tomorrow. How I’m invested is longer term. So I’m invested for at least the next five years or so.

And I do believe that if we get through the fall and we don’t have lockdowns in the United States, Europe and Asia, then I definitely think six to nine months, we’re back in the swing of things, because that’ll put us right to basically next spring when oil demand really starts.

TN: Sam, what’s your view in Europe on lockdowns? Do you see that stuff coming back and how do you see that impacting consumption?

SM: I would think that it would be mostly in the countries with the high population density. Germany is obviously one of those countries and the UK is another. In other countries, not so much the case. I live here in Sweden. We never had lockdowns. So we had seniors living in retirement homes and so on. But then, we pretty much met the same statistic level as every other country — 10% population suffer through it, 1% or so perished as a result. But I don’t think that we’ll be seeing any big efforts on locking down countries again.

And what’s more interesting now is schools are coming up in a couple of months or at least a month and a half. Here in Sweden, life will pretty much continue as is. I have four kids and none of them missed more than a week of school, throughout the entire ordeal since 2020.

TN: So it sounds to me like you both see there may be some lockdowns at the edges, but it doesn’t sound like it’s something you expect to affect the mainstream. Maybe we see a slight dip in the rate of rise of demand. But it doesn’t sound like it’ll have a huge impact to the downside on energy prices generally, whether it’s crude or natgas or something like that. Is that fair to say?

SM: Yep.

TS: Absolutely.

TN: When it comes to natural gas, Tracy, I know you’ve been talking about that a lot lately. Can you tell us a little bit about your observations and your thesis and and what you’re seeing there?

TS: For natural gas, the reason I like it is it’s the great transition fuel especially for emerging markets, because it’s very inexpensive than to go straight into something like solar or wind just because the cost of those minerals and metals can make those are skyrocketing right now. So natural gas is abundant. It’s a great transition fuel. It’s cleaner burning than oil.

We just saw the EU green deal, they just stepped back and now are including that gas, whereas before there was no oil or gas, because I think they’re also realizing that it’s inexpensive, it’s a good transition fuel. If you look at Germany, there’s still a lot of coal going on in Germany. So for Europe, it’s not like fossil fuels are gone.

I think they realize also it’s an inexpensive transition fuel. In particular for the United States, what I like right now is we’re seeing European natgas ETF and JKM, which is the Asian natgas, are trading at significantly higher than the United States is right now. And so I think there is opportunity there because the US can export and still come in at a lower cost, even with the cost of transportation to Europe or to Asia.

TN: Interesting. Living in Texas, I have to say that I love that message. Sam, what about the tanker fleet? Is the global tanker fleet ready to to provide the capacity needed to power EMs with, say, American natgas or Middle Eastern natgas?

SM: So natgas, I haven’t checked too much. But tankers in general, the demand is not that great right now. When I say that, I mean that usually, they really step up to the plate whenever there’s a floating storage opportunity to talk about. So you had that case in Q2 of last year, and that really drove up the prices from the growing normal rate of 20,000 barrels a day to 500,000. That spike.

And it’s come down so much. Complete occupancy is far lower than what I normally see if I talk about the tonnage and it’s around under 40%, which is very little. We were looking at April of last year, it was around north of 55, close to 60%. So that’s a big swing. And that really crushed the prices for tanker rates. They’re even negative. Below zero. But when I look at the transfers of illicit oil, it’s around $38,000 a day. So there’s a lot lot of money to be made in those transfers, unfortunately. But for nat-G, I’m not entirely sure. So I can’t say for sure.

TN: OK, very good. Guys, thank you so much for your time. This has been really helpful. I’m really intrigued by kind of the long bull thesis for energy because we hope that we’re going to start recovering much quicker than we had been, which is fantastic. So thanks for your time. I really appreciate. Always, I really appreciate talking with you guys. Thanks very much.

QuickHit Visual (Videos)

QuickHit: China is not going to stop being China

Post author By admin
Post date August 7, 2020

Panama Canal Authority’s Silvia Fernandez de Marucci joins us for this week’s QuickHit, where explains why China is not going to stop being China. She also shares first-hand observation on the global trade trends — is it declining and by how much, what’s happening in cruises and cargo vessels, where do gas and oil shipments are redirecting, why June was worse than May, and what about July? She also shares the “star” in this pandemic and whether there’s a noticeable regionalization changes from Asia to Europe, and when can we see it happening? Also, what does Panama Canal do to be up-to-date with technology and to adapt the new normal?

Silvia is the Canal’s manager of market analysis and customer relations. She has 20 years of experience studying all the markets for them and is responsible for their pricing strategy, their forecasting of traffic and customer relations.

Panama Canal opened in 1914 with annual traffic of 14,702 vessels in 2008. By 2012, more than 815,000 vessels had passed through the canal. It takes 11.38 hours to pass through it. The American Society of Civil Engineers has ranked the Panama Canal one of the seven wonders of the modern world.

***This video was recorded on July 30, 2020 CDT.

The views and opinions expressed in this QuickHit episode are those of the guests and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of Complete Intelligence. Any content provided by our guests are of their opinion and are not intended to malign any political party, religion, ethnic group, club, organization, company, individual or anyone or anything.

Show Notes

TN: Recently, the CPB of the Netherlands came out and said that world trade was down by double digits for the first five months of the year. Obviously that’s related to COVID. Can you tell us a little bit about what you’ve seen at the Canal and really what you guys have been doing? Everyone’s been in reactionary mode. So what have you seen happening in the market?

SM: There are some trends that had been present before COVID like the movement of production from China to Eastern Asia and we think this is going to be accelerated by this pandemia. But I don’t think that China is going to stop being China. It will keep the relevance and the importance in global trade as they have today.

We think that probably, yes, we will see more regionalization. We saw the signing of the renewal of the NAFTA trade between Canada, the US, and Mexico. So we think that there may be something happening in that area. However, we don’t see that trade is going to stop. I mean trade is going to continue growing after this pandemic.

This is something that I would say very different from anything that we have experienced before because once it is solved, I don’t know if the vaccine appears and people start going back to the new normal, there will be changes probably to the way we do things and the consumer is going to be very careful and probably will change his habits in order to prevent contagion. But I think trade is going to continue.

We see some of these trends becoming more and more important or at a faster pace. It is not an economic crisis per se. Once the people are going back to work, the industry will restart their operations, people are going to be rehired. The economy should start recovering faster. We are not sure because there is no certainty with this situation.

We first heard about it early in the year with the cases in China. But then, it looked so far away. It was happening to China. It was happening to Italy. We didn’t think about it as something that was so important or so relevant. The first casualty was the passenger vessels. The whole season for cruise ships at the Canal was cut short in March and Panama went to a total lockdown on March 25.

It really started for us when we received the news of a cruise ship arriving in Panama with influenza-like disease on board that wanted to cross, which was the Zaandam, and the first one that we had with the COVID patients on board.

TN: And how much of your traffic is cruise ships?

SM: It’s very small, to be honest. It’s less than two percent of our traffic. But still, we see it as an important segment, not only because of the traffic through the Canal, but also because of what it does to the local economy. We have a lot of visitors, a lot of tourism, and that is a good injection of cash coming to Panama. It was the probably the end of the season but it was shorter than what we would have wanted.

TN: When we saw the first wave of COVID go through Asia, did you see a a sharp decline in vessel traffic in say Feb, March? Or was it pretty even? Did we not see that much? Because I’ve spoken to people in air freight and they said it was dramatic, the fall off they saw. I would imagine in sea freight, it’s not as dramatic but did you see a fall off?

SM: It started in January, which is the very low season for containers, which is the most important market segments in terms of contribution to tolls. When we saw that there was this COVID happening in Chinese New Year, everything was closed. We were in a slow season. So we didn’t see much of an impact.

And for the Canal, there is a lagging effect because we are 23 days away in voyage terms. So whatever happens in China, we feel it probably one month later. We expected January and February to be slow because of the normal seasonality of the trade. But then after March, I would say that April was probably the worst month for us. We were hit April then May was worse than April and then June that was even worse than than May.

TN: June was worse than May? Okay.

SM: June was worse than May. We‘ve seen four percent, ten percent, fourteen or sixteen percent decline each month. It was like, “Oh wow! This is really thick. This is really getting worse.” We had reviewed our forecast in April. And I think so far, it is behaving as we expected back then. But there’s nothing written about COVID. We are learning as we go.

I would say that container vessels were also affected these three months of the year. We have LNG vessels that were supposed to deliver natural gas to Japan, Korea, and China. And LNG had been behaving very badly all year. That is kind of a peak season for LNG and LNG has been having a hard time because the market were supplied and the prices were very low, so many shipments that were supposed to end up in Asia, ended up in Europe or other destinations that were more profitable for the owners. But when the price of oil collapsed and went negative, the prices of LNG were affected in the Middle East and became more competitive than the US prices.

We saw a harsher decline in LNG shipments. We see, for example, 30 percent less than we expected to see and by COVID in April, it was probably 50 percent below what we were expecting. It was major and Iguess it’s a matter of demand because since the whole Asia was locked down, there was no demand.

TN: When industry stops, you don’t need energy. It’s terrible.

SM: Exactly. It’s really terrible. It was terrible. But we had some stars in our trade that supported the situation like LPG, the cooking gas and obviously people were cooking more at home so the demand was high and we saw an increase in trade for LPG. It’s a good market for us, for the neopanamax locks, so in a way we are grateful that our trade has not suffered as much as we have seen in other areas.

TN: You said you declined into June. How have things been in in July, so far?

SM: July seems promising. We came from a from a very bad June that was closed probably 16 percent below what we expected to have. But July is about maybe seven percent below our expectation. But we are very concerned about a potential W-shape recovery because of the new cases that we have seen in the US.

TN: When we saw factories close across Asia in the first quarter and in some cases stay until the second quarter, did you see some of the folks who were shipping through the Canal start to pivot their production to North America?

SM: It’s probably too early to say. We will see the effects of COVID probably in terms of near shoring maybe in two years. I don’t think that the companies or the factories are so quick as to move the production especially during this period in which everybody is still trying to cope with the situation.

TN: And manage their risks, right?

SM: Yes. So I don’t see that happening anytime soon. But it’s probably something that the factories and the companies are going to start speeding up and diversifying their production.

TN: And as you said earlier, China’s still going to be there. China’s not going to disappear as an origin, right? What I’ve been saying to people is it’s incremental manufacturing that may move. It’s not the mainstay of Chinese manufacturing that’s going to move or regionalize. They’re still going to do much of the commoditized manufacturing there because the infrastructure is there.The sunk cost is there, and they need to earn out the value of those factories. I like your timeline of two years before you really start to see an impact because we may see some incremental movement and maybe some very high value, high tech stuff or something like that move first but the volume of things probably won’t happen for at least two years. Is that fair to say?

SM: I would say so and I would add that we have seen these shifts to Vietnam and Malaysia and other countries in Asia, but we still see containerized cargo shipping from China. The volumes are still not high enough to be shipping directly from those countries. The container may come from Vietnam and or from Malaysia and they come to Shanghai or to another port in China. They consolidate the vessel there and the vessel departs from those ports. So in terms of Canal, for us that is good news. And I would say that probably Korea is trying to attract that tradition as well. So the long voyage will start in China or in Korea or in Japan instead of these other countries that are further away from our area of relevance.

TN: That makes a lot of sense. Just one last question. How do you see transit changing over the next five to ten years? What are you seeing from the Canal perspective in the way your operations will change?

SM: We are still adjusting to what is happening. We have always been very regulated in the best way. What I mean is that we have always had our protocols and codes for attending every situation. We have our protocol for infectious diseases that was the basis to start working with COVID. We think that at the canal probably, what we will see in the future is more technology to improve the operation. I’m not sure exactly how, but definitely there are machine learning and artificial intelligence that may help us be more accurate in our forecasts and probably organize our traffic in a way that is faster or we make better use of the assets. The canal is 106 years old. We have been adjusting every time to the new ways of the world, and we’ll continue to do so as a trade enabler.

TN: That’s right. Silvia, thank you so much for your time. This has been very insightful. I really do hope that we can connect again in some time and and just see how trade recovers and what we look like maybe going into 2021 or something like that. Okay. Thank you so much.

SM: Thanks to you.

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