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QuickHit: We’re not going to normalize

In this episode, our expert guest Grant Wilson of Exante Data said that “we’re not going to normalize” and that countries need to make the very difficult decision to risk re-infection or re-outbreak in order to reopen the economy.

 

Grant Wilson is the Head of Asia Pacific for Exante Data, a macro advisory and data analytics company based in New York, with a broad global client roster. Exante Data was one of the first to identify and analyze the impact of Coronavirus with detailed data.

 

You can also check out our previous QuickHit episodes: How do we use up all the corn now? and How ready is the military to face COVID-19 and its challenges?

 

Show Notes

 

GW: So we saw COVID very early – mid to late January. In fact, I positioned it as a key risk factor for our clients. And as the situation evolved we just stayed with it.

 

We moved the firm increasingly towards all data through this period because we’re trying to assess how the virus is affecting the economy: [what are the] different scenarios to restart in different countries, different sectors, which is really the most germane question at the moment.

 

TN: Where do you think we are? I think the initial shock is past. Do you think we’re on a path to normalization or are we still in a hesitation phase before we get on to that normalization path or something different?

 

GW: I think it’s something different. I don’t think we’re going to normalize. I do think there are going to be industries, which have fundamentally changed coming out of this. People want to put a time frame on it, and I think you just got a run with it.

 

But to give you some examples, I’m extremely pessimistic about commercial real estate globally. The way people work has changed fundamentally, and it’s not going to change back. Whether the virus comes off a little bit more or whether we do get a second wave. The fundamental changes that are happening in terms of office environment, the digitization of communication. Those things are not going to turn around. So if you’re a large landlord or a sponsor of CMBX, derivative structure, you’ve got some real problems, and it does not matter where the virus is.

 

Similarly like public infrastructure. People are clearly using less trains, less buses, obviously less planes. Interesting that there could be a shift back to private car usage. We are trying to think through the secular things coming out of this.

 

And then for the virus itself, one of the most peculiar things is that there’s only probably a couple of countries globally that can truly achieve elimination, like to totally get rid of the virus within a proximate, self-contained environment. New Zealand’s a very good example of that. In Australia, the case counts are extremely low. So the rest of the world will not eliminate this thing. They’re gonna have to pick and make these really, really difficult decisions about how much of a virus risk and re-outbreak that they want to tolerate as against the imperatives of restarting the economy.

 

TN: A lot of the talk was about flattening the curve, which was about reducing the kind of overwhelming capacity going into hospitals so they could actually treat people. That flattening the curve discussion has changed to something different. And it seems to almost be approaching a zero-tolerance discussion where we have these lockdowns and people can’t go into work and make a living.

 

In the States, we recently saw Elon Musk threatened to move his company out of California to Texas potentially so that he could get his company to work. And the State of California or the county relented and let them come into work. Are we in a period where there’s selective lockdowns? Does flattening the curve mean anything anymore? What are you seeing in terms of the economy, industries?

 

GW: The thing is that a lot of companies, retail, hospitality, mass events, you know football games, basketball, things like that, they don’t really work in this model where you have social distancing. And so, you either really just have to go for full eradication. But it’s not possible in many of these places. You’re going to have to tolerate some reinfection risk and get on with it.

 

I’m very far away from the U.S., but we’re tracking it very closely state-by-state that there is sort of a polarization developing where Republican states are more inclined to try to restart the economy and sort of run this risk. Democratic states are still more tolerant of lockdown. And it seems increasingly politicized, and that’s not a great surprise given you’ve got a big event at the end of the year.

 

I’ve contrasted to Europe. When you listen to Angela Merkel, not Britain because Britain was very late and very confused in terms of their strategy. She’s a scientist by training and she explained very, very clearly that the first part of the strategy was to make sure that they didn’t blow through their ICU constraint. And now that they’ve achieved that, indeed they have flattened a curve. They’re not gunning for elimination. They know they can’t get there. And so they’re just trying to manage what’s known as the r0 so it doesn’t pop back up above one and you have a real explosive re-acceleration. But they’re having to live with it.

 

What still hasn’t necessarily gotten through to people, is that business models that worked previously don’t work anymore. It’s very hard to see how a lot of small and medium-term enterprises are going to make it out of this. And I think that’s the Chapter 3 or Chapter 4 version of it. But that’s the concern. There’ll be some winners and there’ll be some adaptation of the economy. But the legacy and the tail on this is just immense. It’s immense.

 

TN: So tell me this. Is there anything good that’s going to come out of this?

 

GW: There’s probably going to be a very significant re-think about climate change. This is going to be one of the first years where carbon emissions globally are going to fall. Effectively, it’s because we shut things down. It was the way that people actually wanted to get there. That’s probably one interesting data point. If you look at that area very closely, we’ve never been able to run a real-time experiment like this. So it will be very interesting to see how the effects sort of percolate through.

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QuickHit: How do we use up all the corn now?

This QuickHit episode, we talked about agriculture commodities with focus on corn ethanol. We are joined by Chris Narayanan with INTL FCStone in their Capital Markets. Chris held several different roles in the commodity space and was formerly a commodities and equity analyst for investment bankers. He explains why we have surplus of corn and other ag commodities and that this problem started way before the global pandemic. What will be the solution, and with crude in trouble, does it mean trouble for corn ethanol as well?

 

Our previous QuickHit talked about the military and the U.S. defense’s biggest supply chain problem: its dependence on the enemy. Watch it here.

 

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The views and opinions expressed in this QuickHit episode are those of the guests and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of Complete Intelligence. Any content provided by our guests are of their opinion and are not intended to malign any political party, religion, ethnic group, club, organization, company, individual or anyone or anything.

 

 

Show Notes

 

TN: I wanted to talk a little bit about ag commodity markets. With all of the COVID-related issues, we’ve seen demand really fall. We’ve seen things like potatoes stacking up and milk being poured out. It’s deflationary, it’s wasteful. How is that impacting markets in terms of the expected supply coming on, and how long do you expect this demand issue to be there?

 

CN: First, I think it’s important to take a step back. When you look at the commodity space, especially at agriculture, in a lot of areas, we’ve been flooded for several years. And then when the Trade War hit, that was another hit to the system. And now the Coronavirus is here, it’s another hit to the system. We’re trying to chew through this as quickly as possible.

 

People are shifting from eating out to eating at home. The buying patterns are changing. The foodstuff needs are changing. You go all the way back through the supply chain, back to the farmer and the rancher, it changes the dynamic.

 

USDA came out, with their monthly ag supply and demand report and they’re pretty optimistic for the new crop year. Now, that’s going take some time, and obviously these are just projections.

 

Looking at my screen right now, the market is a little lukewarm to it. As we get to the growing season, we what kind of supply we can expect, and then once the harvest hits, we’ll know, in terms of the global economy, how much we actually need.

 

TN: We saw some freezes over the weekend as well in the Midwest. Is that hurting things or is that late freeze something that just happens occasionally and markets just work that in?

 

CN: It depends on where it is and what stage they are. Planning is all over the place in a lot of areas and it depends on what crop you’re talking about. I don’t think you can make a blanket statement on that. But certainly, depending on the damage and the intensity on the area, there could be some damage. That might be supportive to prices at some point. But I think it’s a little early to say.

 

TN: What about things like corn? When we can move into talking about ethanol or fuels or some of the downstream products? Do you see this freeze hurting the corn crop, so it would tighten up the demand environment a little bit? Or is it all fine and it’s not really going hurt supply?

 

CN: It depends on where they are in planning. We’re in the middle of May. A lot of people hope to be done by now. If they didn’t get it in the ground, they might delay for a couple of weeks. If they did have it in the ground, they had some early emergence in some of the southern areas. But where the freeze really didn’t hit, it shouldn’t have that big of an impact.

 

I think the big thing is how do we use up the corn that we have? In the last decade, we’ve seen a huge increase in corn supplies. I look at the amount that’s left over at the end of a crop year divided by how much we used in that particular year. That’s been on the rise, and I think ethanol is a big portion of it. When people talk about ethanol, they say we need an increase in blend or go from E10, E15, or even higher.

 

In my opinion, that’s just kicking the can down the road. You’ll see an uptick for a little while — five, seven years or whatever that number is, and then it’s going to level off again back to where we are. You’ve just reset the base, but you don’t really solve the problem in a more long-term fashion.

 

I think there are two big things that we’re seeing in this current situation. First, driving fuel efficiency on vehicles has increased over the last 15-20 years. We’re driving more miles per gallon of gasoline. So incrementally, you need less ethanol to blend with the gasoline. The second part of efficiency is we are producing more gallons of ethanol with less bushels of corn. You need less corn than you did before. And now with the Coronavirus, people aren’t driving. We have a lot of stay-at-home orders that are starting to expire in some parts of the country. But again, you’re not driving, so you just don’t need to buy as much gasoline. I mean, my truck tank is half-full, and I think the last time I filled it was about a month-and-a-half or two months ago. 

 

What we needed to look at is how can we best work ethanol into global trade and where are the export markets. For example, we have the RFS and the RFS2 – biofuels and advanced biofuels. We can bring in Brazilian ethanol made from sugarcane and export corn ethanol to them. It’s just one example of a symbiotic relationship where the blenders here would get credits.

 

TN: How is that different? Are there differences between sugarcane ethanol and corn ethanol in terms of the end use?

 

CN: In terms of the end use, no. It’s the same. It’s really the process in which it’s made and how the EPA and other organizations look at the efficiency, the cleanliness, and the process of producing it all. At the end of the day, it blends, and specs will dictate. But theoretically it’s going to be just another substitute of each other.

 

TN: I’m just curious just to dig into that, why would the U.S. import Brazilian ethanol and export corn ethanol? Are they substitutional? 

 

CN: To an extent they are substitutes. So that makes it a little bit more practical. Back when we had blending credits, there were different credits that you can get depending on the stage. Corn ethanol was the most basic.

From a completely economic standpoint, if you’re a blender that has to purchase this ethanol to mix in with your gasoline, there was, at the time, an incentive involved for the added cost of doing this. So if we can work through this policy, maybe update the policies, look at our global trade where in any given year, you might have a surplus in one country and the other, why not introduce some kind of a trade scheme where you help each other out, right?

 

Because if you go to Brazil for example, you can go to a pump and they literally dial in E0 to E100. They can run their engines on most. And they run that mix depending on the economics, I think it was like 70. If the price of ethanol was 70% of gasoline or less then, it was more economic to use ethanol.

 

Some people say that you see a slight loss in fuel efficiency and so there’s that kind of scale that you can apply and use to your advantage. Look in the fact that you can increase the blend wall and maybe go to E20 or E25. And the tests from the engineers show that that’s not gonna do anything to the vehicle, then that’s great. But again, it’s a temporary fix — temporary meaning in the next ten years versus what I’m looking like 30, 40 years ahead in the future.

 

TN: So with crude oil prices depressed, how hard will it be to get those refiners to include ethanol? Are those blenders to include ethanol if crude and gasoline are super cheap?

 

CN: So here’s the thing that nobody talks about. We have the Clean Air Act, which introduced the cafe standards for fuel efficiency. In 30 different partners around the US, you have to introduce some kind of an oxygenate to basically treat the gasoline. MTBE was the preferred substance at the time but it was found to pollute groundwater. 30 some-odd different states banned it, so that effectively made a de facto nationwide ban on it. So to meet the Clean Air Act in those cafe standards, you had to introduce something. Ethanol was what came in. It burned clean. It was renewable. It didn’t pollute groundwater and it helped make that standard.

 

When I was at a previous job, going back about seven years ago or so, I was working with one of my other commodity analysts and we did a joint paper on corn gasoline and ethanol. If memory serves, it was like E6.2 or something where when you look at the different summer blends versus the winter blend the different metropolitan areas and you distill down to what do we actually need.

 

Until you find another additive to take the place of ethanol that’s cheaper, safer, or at least
safe, you still have some incremental demand that needs to be put into the gasoline that’s just required by law.

 

TN: Chris, thanks so much for your time today. I really appreciate it. I’d love to circle back and talk about other ag commodities in a couple of months to see where things are at.

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QuickHit: Oil companies will either shut-in or cut back, layoffs not done yet

We continue discussing oil companies this week with Tracy Shuchart, who is a portfolio manager and considered as one of the leading experts on crude trading. Tony Nash asked who is trading oil these days, why the oil went negative, and when can we see a bit of recovery for the industry? Most importantly, will layoffs continue, and at what pace?

 

The views and opinions expressed in this QuickHit episode are those of the guests and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of Complete Intelligence. Any content provided by our guests are of their opinion and are not intended to malign any political party, religion, ethnic group, club, organization, company, individual or anyone or anything.

 

Show Notes

 

TN: Hi everyone. This is Tony with Complete Intelligence. We’re here doing a QuickHit, which is one of our quick discussions. Today, we are talking with Tracy Shuchart, who is a portfolio manager with a private equity fund and she is one of the foremost experts on crude trading. We’ve had a number of conversations with her already, and we’re really lucky to get a little bit of her time today.

 

Tracy, just a few days ago, I was talking with Vandana Hari, who was formerly a Research Scholar at Platts and knows everything about energy. She was telling me that there are three to four months of crude oil supply, and that’s the imbalance that we have in markets right now. That’s why we see WTI at less than 20 and these really difficult price hurdles for people to get over. Can you tell us who’s trading crude oil right now? Is it mom and pops? Is it professionals? What does that look like? And also, what will have to happen for those prices to rise, generally?

 

 

TS: Right. Right now, the USO had to get on the prep-month contracts.  

 

TN: Sorry, just to clarify for people who aren’t trading ETF’s. USO is a broadly traded energy ETF, and they’ve had a lot of problems with the structure of the futures that they trade. So they’ve had to push back the futures that they trade from the front month, which is the nearest month that’s traded to further back in a channel in hopes that the value of crude oil in the further of months trades higher than the current one. So they’ve done a lot of reconfiguration over the last few weeks. So sorry. I just wanted to explain that.

 

 

TS: That’s okay. They’re out of the front month. Bank of China just had a big problem when oil prices went negative. They had a lot of money in the front months. They’re out.

 

Most retail brokers are not allowing regular retail to be traded in the front couple months actually. All that you have trading front months are the big funds, anybody who’s been hedging and then maybe a bank or two. But it’s definitely not retail that’s in there, and there are a lot of big players now that are not in there.

 

When we get towards expiration, the problem is that most of the funds are pretty short and most of the hedgers are pretty short, and the banks are on the opposite side of that trade. But when we come to expiration, what I’m worried

about again is we’re going to have a no-bid scenario. We’re going to have that vacuum once again. You’re not going to have any natural buyers there.

 

 

TN: Okay. So the WTI traded in the US goes negative, but the WTI traded in London on the ICE doesn’t go negative.

 

 

TS: They just decided not to let that contract go negative. The difference between the contracts is the CME Group contract is physically deliverable, right? And ICE contract is a cash-settled contract. So they’re not going negative, but CME allowed this contract to go negative.

 

And they actually put out a notice about five days before that they were going to start letting some contracts go negative. This wasn’t a total surprise, as soon as I saw that, I thought it was going to go negative.

 

 

TN: Both you and I have told stories about how we had friends who wanted to trade. Like I had a couple of friends who wanted to triple long Crude ETF a week and a half before it went negative, and I said, “please, please don’t do that.” So grateful that neither of them did that because it could have been terrible.

 

So how do we clear this? We’ve got three-four months of oil just sitting around?

 

 

TS: If you talk to most of the big trading houses in Switzerland like Vitol, Trafigura, etc., basically their base case scenario, and they’re physical traders, their BEST scenario is it’ll be September before we get some sort of hints of a balance left.

 

So what is going to happen? There are either two things. We’re going to fill up storage, and then producers literally won’t have to shut it. There’s nowhere to put it, so they literally have to do what I call forced shut-ins. If you don’t want to shut-in, the market is going to force you to do that. That scenario is going to happen. Or we’re going to get a scenario where people decide to voluntarily cut back. Just look at the backend like CLR, Continental Resources just did that. They shut in about 30 percent of their production on the back end, and I think there’s about thirty-five to forty percent now that’s shut-in. And there are some other basins where that’s happening as well, in the Permian, etc.

 

 

TN: So that’s mostly people in the field they’ll probably let go. Will we see people at headquarters? Those CEOs or only those workers in the field?

 

 

TS: I think you’re going to see a broad range of layoffs. It’s already happening. You’ve already seen companies lay off a bunch of people… Halliburton’s laid off. Everybody’s laying off people. And they’re not just laying off field workers as they’re shutting rigs down, they’re cutting back on their office help, too.

 

And with the shutdown, it’s even more worrisome because maybe they figure out that, “we definitely don’t need this many people,” and all these people working remotely.

 

I don’t think that the layoffs are done yet. We’ve only had a couple of months of low oil prices. If this continues for another 3-4 months, we’re definitely in trouble.

 

 

TN: So is this time different? I mean if we were to stop today, and let’s say things come back to 30 bucks tomorrow, which they won’t. But if it stopped today, would the oil and gas industry look at this go, “Thank God we dodged that bullet, again?” Do they just go back to normal like nothing happened? Or if it were to stop today, would they say “Gosh, we really need to kind of reform who we are. Focus on productivity and become a modern business?” How long does it take for them to really make those realizations?

 

 

TS: I think what’s going to have to happen, which may not happen, is the money runs out, right?

 

So first, you had to ride the shale boom. All these banks throwing money on it. After 2016, things were easing up. So private equity guys got in there, and they threw a bunch of money at it. Basically, these guys are going to keep doing what they’re doing as long as they have a source of equity and a source of capital thrown at them all the time. As soon as that dries up, then they’ll be forced to delete and go out of business. We’re already seeing that happen. We’ve had over 200 bankruptcies just in the last four years alone, and this year we’re starting high. So they’re either going to go out of business — Chapter 7s, not 11s. And the thing is that with the big guys, like Chevron and Exxon that just entered into the Permian, they’re just waiting to chomp on some stranded assets.

 

So again, what it’s going to take is the money’s got to dry up or they go out of business. That’s the only way I really see them changing.

 

 

TN: Yeah and we’re just at the beginning, which is really hard to take because it’s tough. So Tracy I’d love to talk for a long, long time, you know that. But we’ve got to keep these short, so thanks so much for your time. I really appreciate your insights. We’ll come back to you again in another couple of weeks just to see where things are. I’m hoping things change. But I’m not certain that they will. So, we’ll be back in a couple of weeks and just see how things are.

 

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QuickHit: There’s no going back for O&G sector jobs

In this week’s QuickHit episode, we have Vandana Hari, CEO and founder of Vanda Insights. She has 25 years of experience in the oil and gas and we asked what she expects to see happening in the near future. Will the oil industry recover, and when? Will bankruptcies and layoffs in big oil firms continue? And what can these companies and the government do to prevent the worst from happening?

 

We also discussed the oil and gas industry in the previous QuickHit episode on what companies can do right now to win post-COVID.

 

The views and opinions expressed in this QuickHit episode are those of the guests and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of Complete Intelligence. Any content provided by our guests are of their opinion and are not intended to malign any political party, religion, ethnic group, club, organization, company, individual or anyone or anything.

 

Show Notes

 

TN: Today we’re joined by Vandana Hari of Vanda Insights. She is one of the top energy market experts in the world. Can you tell us a little bit about your firm and what you do?

 

VH: I have been looking at the oil markets for 25 years now. I started my firm Vanda Insights, which provides global oil markets macro analysis about 4 years ago. Prior to that, I worked with Platts, which is a very well-known name in energy commodities. I looked at the pricing of crude, refined products and various other energy commodities. I covered news and analysis.

 

TN: Great. So it’s obvious why you’re here. Crude markets are in crisis. The big, big question is how long are we in this kind of sub $20, sub $30 zone? Generally, what’s your expectation for the length of that super depressed pricing?

 

VH: It’s certainly not going to be a v-shaped recovery. As we speak Brent, a benchmark crude, is trading around $22 to $23 a barrel. US WTI, another benchmark, is trading around $12 or $13 dollars a barrel. Now where do I see these going?

 

As we look out into May, and I’m taking into consideration a couple of factors there. One is that we are starting to see gradual reopening of the economy in Europe, the worst-hit countries Italy, Spain, France, Germany, and then we have the US and as we were discussing offline, Texas is looking to reopen. Some of the other US states are going to reopen as well. The oil markets will have a very close eye on these re-openings because they have the answer to demand revival. We are coming out of an unforeseen, unprecedented trough in global oil demand close to 30%–30 million barrels per day–of global oil demand has been destroyed. How does this go into May?

 

I’m expecting a very extremely slow gradual revival. There may be a bit of an impetus and upward boost to oil prices from a gradual reopening. Nothing like what we are seeing in the stock markets, though. I think that’s where stocks and stock markets and oil are going to decouple and have already started to decouple from what I can see.

 

The other element is going to be supply. So OPEC and non-OPEC alliance of 23 members. 20 out of those 23 have committed to reducing production collectively by about 9.7 million barrels per day for May and June. Now typically, that sort of an announcement, which happened back on the 12th of April would have in itself boosted oil prices. But this one didn’t. Now clearly it is seen as too little too late. Nonetheless, it will start mopping up some surplus. It’s just that it will again be very slow in giving any sort of positive signals to oil because remember, oil has to work through nearly three months of oversupply and an overhang. So the glut is going to take its time to disappear.

 

TN: It’s a demand problem, right? It’s a supply problem, but you do have lack of demand from the government shutdowns, and then there is supply continuing to come online. All of this issue, it makes me wonder bout the shale companies. I’m curious about shale and kind of privately held independent oil companies. But I also want to learn a little bit about NOCs, the national oil companies. If you don’t mind telling us, what is your view on shale? And how do you expect the NOC’s to fare after this? Do you think they’ll thrive? Do you think they’ll cut the fat? Do you think they’ll change at all, or do you think they’ll just continue to lumber along as they have for the past whatever 70 years?

 

VH: The one characteristic of this crisis is that the pain in the oil sector is being felt and will continue to be felt across the spectrum, all the way, from oil production to refining to logistics. And we can talk about logistics in a little bit as well, because that’s doing quite well now because of storage demand.

 

However, the pain is going to be felt all the way down to refining and retail. It’s also going to be spread across geographies. It’s going to be spread across the size and nature of companies, whether you are an oil major or an independent or an NOC.

 

Let’s talk about shale first. It’s not just the OPEC, non-OPEC enforced mandated cuts, but I am expecting to see major decline starting to happen in North America, in Brazil and perhaps in other places like the North Sea as well. What happens in the US is going to be key because it’s the biggest oil producer, thanks to the shale boom. Shale contributes nearly 80% of US oil production. What happens to shale is also going to hold the key to US energy independence in the future.

 

I also look at a couple of very key metrics in the shale patch. One is the weekly rig count that I monitor from Baker Hughes. The other one is a weekly count of the fracturing fleet. So in the hydraulic fracturing, it is far more jaw-dropping decline in numbers that have seen. 70% drop in the frat fleets currently versus the start of this year.

 

What all of that tells me, and we’ve done some number crunching of our own, is we expect to see close to a million barrels per day of decline in June going up to 2 million barrels per day in July. That’s something that the oil market is not quite factoring in yet. Let’s remember that shale bounced back phenomenally after the 2014-16 downturn. That’s the impression that the market has. That shale may be down on its knees, but it will bounce back. But this time, I think it’s going to be very, very different. It’s going to be nothing like a bounce back.

 

As far as national oil companies are concerned, I look at them quite closely sitting here in Asia, they are a breed in themselves. A lot of them are lumbering giants, very slow to change. Most of them are directly controlled by the government or have majority state ownership.

 

Now, one of the things that I have noticed that is going in favor of the NOC’s, especially in Asia–countries like India, China, even places in Southeast Asia–is that they have a captive, domestic, fast-growing market. These NOCs also tend to be vertically integrated, so and more often than not, Asia is a net importer of crude. They have giant refining operations and relatively less upstream or oil and gas production operations.

 

Refining is also getting hit in the current downturn. What we see refiners doing, which includes these NOCs of course, are they’re cutting back out. Port refining margins are terrible. They have gone into negative for a lot of the major products. How will the NOCs survive this? I think they come out of this with a great deal of financial strain. We have to see to what extent they get government support. Some of the NOCs, unfortunately, especially in countries like Indonesia, also struggle with fuel subsidies. So those might fare even worse in the recovery mode. Overall, I think another transition that’s going to take hold for NOCs is the investment in technology: to be more efficient whether you’re producing or refining or retailing oil. And to be more environmentally-friendly with products.

 

TN: Do you think they’ll be more productive? Do you think they’ll invest in technology? Just across the board with oil and gas companies in general. Do you think they’ll actually invest in productivity or do you think they’ll just kind of hold their breath and buckle down like they have always done? Can they afford to do that this time?

 

VH: So when it comes to technology, specifically for cleaner energy, it tends to be driven more by regulation than by market forces or by just companies one day waking up and deciding “Hey, I’m going to be more environmentally friendly.” It just doesn’t happen that way, and that’s certainly true for NOCs. I think oil majors are under a slightly different kind of dynamic. We’ve seen, for instance, only in recent weeks, BP and Shell double-down on their commitment towards greener, cleaner energy. Of course, their feet are being held to the fire by their shareholders.

 

NOCs are in a very different environment. I think a lot will depend on to what extent governments in Asia re-commit themselves to the Paris Agreement, and are part of the global drive towards cleaner energy. We have seen in recent years visible, tangible air pollution has been a major concern in cities all the way from Delhi to Beijing.

 

TN: As we as we stop under COVID, you know, air quality has improved dramatically, right?

 

VH: Yes indeed. You have to think when people go back to the new normal, and they are out and about and the pollution levels increase, what will that do in terms of pressure on these companies? So overall, I think the pressure from the environment will remain, to adopt new technologies, to move towards cleaner fuels.

 

Pressure from oil prices to be more efficient may be the case for NOCs. I see that a little bit less, and they’ll have to just pick and choose basically, right? But your big question, where does the money come from? I think that remains a major, major issue. Will they be able to raise money? So we’ve seen in the latest crisis, a few oil companies that are well-regarded, oil majors have tapped banks and raised loans. What I would personally love to see is for these NOCs to come out there a little more aggressively, because after all, they will be back in favor, thanks to the captive market. So I’d love to see them raise money with bonds, bank loans, or whatever, because they will need money from outside. There certainly won’t be enough to dip into their pockets.

 

TN: Yeah. The national accounts from any of these countries can’t really handle it. So that’s a great point.

 

We’re running long, but I don’t want to stop this conversation. So normally, I’d cut this off. But let me ask you one last question, okay? I live in Houston, Texas, and oil and gas town. We’ve seen some layoffs. But we actually haven’t seen a lot yet. You don’t live here so, you know, you can give us an unbiased view of the energy sector. What do you expect, and it’s not just Houston, of course, it’s the energy sector globally. Are we at the midpoint of energy layoffs, are we early, are we late? I mean, how bad do you expect it to get?

 

VH: I think we are probably at the beginning of it. So we have started seeing bankruptcies in the shale sector. Well, to be clear, the bankruptcies in the shale sector accelerated even in 2019. Shareholders and lenders have been becoming disenchanted with the sector for a while. But I do expect bankruptcies to set a record unfortunately in 2020, perhaps spilling over into 2021 as well.

 

But when I look at the US energy sector, I’m also paying attention to a lot of news about the US government making a lot of noise about wanting to help the energy sector. So whether it be, opening up the Strategic Petroleum Reserve, allowing producers to store oil there or to giving them loans from the Fed’s Main Street Lending program. All of that, remains to be seen, and we’ve heard some ideas about banning or putting tariffs on OPEC crude and so on, which probably won’t happen. But I think some of these other measures will happen.

 

My concern is that for most companies, it will probably be too little too late. So I do expect a huge consolidation, and unfortunately a lot of layoffs. People will just have to reinvent themselves, learn new skills, because there may be no going back to oil sector jobs.

 

TN: I think you’re right. I think it’s a generational change. I think it’s a really tough time, and you know these people, it’s nothing they deserve, it’s nothing they’ve even done. But it’s just a very tough global situation where supply outweighs demand. It’s that simple.

 

So Vandana, this has been amazing. I haven’t done any of these interviews that are this long. I’m so grateful to get this much of your time. Thanks you and I’m hoping maybe we can revisit with you in a few months see where things are and take stock of what the future holds?

 

VH: It’s been my pleasure, Tony and I’d love to do this again and thank you to our viewers who’ve stayed with us all the way to the end. I hope it has been worth it.

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QuickHit: 2 Things Oil & Gas Companies Need to Do Right Now to Win Post Pandemic

This week’s QuickHit, Tony Nash speaks with Geoffrey Cann, a digital transformation expert for oil & gas companies, about what he considers as “the worst downturn” for the industry. What should these companies do in a time like this to emerge as a winner?

 

Watch the previous QuickHit episode on how healthy are banks in this COVID-19 era with Dave Mayo, CEO and Founder of FedFis.

 

The views and opinions expressed in this QuickHit episode are those of the guests and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of Complete Intelligence. Any content provided by our guests are of their opinion and are not intended to malign any political party, religion, ethnic group, club, organization, company, individual or anyone or anything.

Show Notes

TN: Hi, everybody. This is Tony Nash with Complete Intelligence. This is one of our QuickHits, which is a quick 5-minute discussion about a very timely topic.

 

Today we’re sitting with Geoffrey Cann. Geoffrey Cann is a Canadian author and oil industry expert and talks about technology and the oil and gas sector.

 

So Geoffrey, thanks so much for being with us today. Do you mind just taking 30 seconds and letting us know a little bit more about you?

 

GC: Oh, sure. Thank you so much, Tony, and thank you for inviting me to join your QuickHit program.

 

So my background, I was a partner with Deloitte in the management consulting area for the better part of 20 years, 30 years altogether. I had an early career with Imperial Oil and I’ve spent most of my career helping oil and gas companies when they face critical challenges.

 

These days, the challenge I was focusing on prior to the pandemic was the adoption of digital innovation into oil and gas because the industry does lag in this adoption curve and yet the technology offers tremendous potential to the sector. I see my mission, and it still doesn’t change just because of the pandemic, as the adoption of digital innovations to assist the industry and to resolve some of its most intractable problems. That’s what I do.

 

 

TN: Wow. Sounds impressive. I’m looking at the downturn in oil and gas and the downturn in prices. There have been big layoffs and cost savings efforts and these sorts of things with oil and gas firms. And, typically, a pullback is an opportunity for the industry to re-evaluate itself and try to figure out the way ahead. Are we there with oil and gas? Do we expect major changes, and as we emerge from the current pullback, how do we expect oil and gas to emerge? We expect more technology to be there. Do we expect more efficiency in productivity? Are there other changes that we expect as we come out of this?

 

 

GC: I’m pessimistic about the prospects for oil and gas and it’s driven by this collapse and available capital and cash flow to the industry.

 

When the industry hits this kind of survival mode, there’s a standard playbook that you dust off. And that playbook includes trimming your capital, canceling projects, downsizing staff, closing facilities, squeezing the supply chain, trimming the dividend. Anything that is considered an investment in the future is put on hold until the industry can get back on its feet.

 

And this is the worst downturn. I’ve lived through six of these. This is the worst I’ve seen.

 

Certainly sharpest, fastest, and deepest and coupled it with the over excess production in the industry. When the industry comes out of the other end of the pandemic, what we’re going to see the industry do is devote its capital to putting its feet back on the ground and getting back into its normal rhythm. But what that means is all the changes that our potential out there are likely to have been set aside in the interim.

 

 

TN: If you were to have your way, and if you were running all the oil companies, and they were to make some changes in this time, what would those changes be? What would some of those key changes be?

 

 

GC: There is a gap between what other industries have discovered, learned, and are adopting, and where oil and gas is at. That gap is, first, needs to be addressed by raising the understanding and the capability and the capacity in oil and gas to deal with the possibilities presented by these technologies. And so there’s task number one that oil and gas companies can absolutely do even during a downturn. Just train people and get them across the newer concepts or newer ideas.

 

A second possibility is to embrace the foundational elements that have proven to be the key success factor for so many other industries. One of those would be cloud computing. The adoption of cloud-based infrastructure, moving data into the cloud, is not costly, it generates an immediate payback because cloud infrastructure is so cheap, and it puts the company into a solid position for when the normal day-to-day running of it gets back in gear, the investments it may have been making an in digital innovation can all now be brought back into stride because this foundational technology will be in place.

 

So those are the two things that I would do: Get people ready for the journey ahead and put one of these foundational steps in place to get ready.

 

 

TN: Those are really enabling technologies, right? They’re not substitutional. They still need people, they still need engineering skills. It’s really just enabling them to do more, right?

 

 

GC: Correct, yeah. And covering off that gap incapacity is the key thing. Somewhere down the road, there will be the adoption of artificial intelligence and machine learning tools to improve the performance of the business. Those are coming and they’re coming very quickly. We’re not there yet. The job is where the industry needs to move forward, and as I see those are the two steps.

 

 

TN: Do you see this as kind of a generational thing? Is this five-ten years away? Or is it an iterative thing where you see it changing bit by bit for each year? How do you see this on the technology side for them?

 

 

GC: Well, in my book, I actually sketched out a way to think about this problem. And I call it the fuse in the bang. The fuses, if you think about Bugs Bunny cartoons. Bugs Bunny and it would be a comically large keg of gunpowder. It’ll be jammed into the back of your Yosemite Sam. As they go racing off, they leave a trail of gunpowder and Bugs would just drop a match in it. It always ended in a comically large but not very terminal explosion. So imagine that the length of fuse, that trail of gunpowder is how much time we’ve got and the size of the keg of gunpowder is how big the impact is going to be. In my book, I could actually go through some ways to think about this.

 

But you have to think about it in these terms, oil and gas is principally a brownfield operations business. In other words, most of the assets predate the Internet Age and they’re continuing to run and they run 24/7, they’re extremely hard to change, and so as a result, the idea that we can quickly jam innovation into these plants is just nonsense. It’s not going to work. So it’s going to take quite a long time.

 

The generation is on two fronts. One is the technology is legacy and therefore it has generational barriers to adoption of change. We also have a workforce, which is tightly coupled to that infrastructure and it also has struggles to cope with change. So we have to come across these two generational shifts that have to happen and they basically have to happen at the same time.

 

 

TN: Very interesting. Geoffrey, I wish we could go on for another hour. There’s so many directions we can take from here. So, thanks much for your time. It’s been really great talking to you and I hope we can revisit this maybe in a couple of months to see where the industry is, how far we’ve come along, just with the downturn of first and second quarter, look later in the year just to see where things are and if we’re in a bit of a better place.

 

 

GC: It’d be great fun because this is, you know, as I’d like to tell people, this is not the time to actually leave or ignore the industry. It’s when it goes through these great troughs like this, this is where exciting things happen, so pay attention.

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QuickHit: How healthy are banks in this COVID-19 era?

 

This week’s QuickHit episode, Tony Nash talked with Dave Mayo, CEO and Founder of FedFis, and an expert on banking, finance, and Fintech. This episode looks at US financial institutions like banks and how they are faring during the Coronavirus pandemic. Will new financial technologies help streamline the process of providing services like loans to medium and small businesses?

 

Watch the previous QuickHit episode on the Status of Global Supply Chain in Time of Coronavirus with the president of Secure Global Logistics, George Booth.

The views and opinions expressed in this QuickHit episode are those of the guests and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of Complete Intelligence. Any content provided by our guests are of their opinion and are not intended to malign any political party, religion, ethnic group, club, organization, company, individual or anyone or anything.

Show Notes

 

TN: Hi, everybody. This is Tony Nash. I’m the founder and CEO of Complete Intelligence. This is our Quick Hit where we talk to industry experts about issues in markets and in industries.

 

Today we’re with Dave Mayo. Dave is the founder and CEO of FedFis based in Texas. Dave, thanks for joining us, I really appreciate it.

 

Can you tell us a little bit about FedFis? And then I’d really love to jump into how you’re helping out the financial services sector.

 

DM: Sure. We’re a unique company. We sit as a layer above banking, we call FI fintech, and then fintech. From the banking side obviously, we are a data company and provider and intelligence. From the FI fintech side, those would be the vendors to the institutions like their core mobile offering. And then FinTech, that’s the new stuff, right? That’s the sexy stuff, like the Chime and the SoFis and those types of companies that used to be alt banking and now they’re joined back to banking again. So we help all of those different layers in one way or another through a data set that we have and intelligence.

 

TN: With everything going on in the wake of Coronavirus, there’s been a lot of talk about fiscal stimulus coming out of D.C. and stimulus through the Fed and other things. What is the health of the banking sector from your perspective? Because back in 2008 the banking sector was the worry, right? Is that the worry now? Is that something we should be worried about?

 

DM: I think our banking industry is based on a level of faith. It always has been, right? Now that said, this is a completely different situation. Banks are very well-capitalized. Banks are not the cause of the problem. We don’t have a systemic banking problem or issue. We’re very, very healthy right now. When you talk about a stimulus being put into the economy, the more money flows in and out, the more people spend and buy and purchase, the better things are. That’s just the way the banking industry is built.

 

TN: How do you see banking and FinTech really helping? Obviously we know how they help big companies with big placements and debt and these sorts of things. But how do you see them helping small and mid-sized companies with this economic gulf that we have right now, where the economy’s effectively been turned off for a period of time, which is a bit weird? How do you see, what you’re doing, and banks generally, really helping out there on the smaller and midsize level?

 

DM: I think there’s a big gap in education in our country when it comes to banking. People are like, “I don’t like banks” or “I like banks.” When there are the big banks, the big four: the B of A, Wells Fargo, Chase, Citi. And then we have community banks.

 

Community bankers all across the country, they’re the life of our banking system. They’re the heartbeat. It’s actually a lower touch point for consumers and FinTech with the dramatic decline in a number of community institutions that has really opened up this opportunity for a FinTech. And the reason being is it’s a direct touch point.

 

So if you were to say “I want to use my mobile device” or “I want to use my online to do banking without having to actually drive to an institution and deal with all their policies and all of the things that go with it,” it’s a faster connection point. And I think we’re probably going to see a lot of that in these business loans the PPP loans through the stimulus plan.

 

TN: How do we actually execute that from the Treasury to the small business owner or to the individual that needs help? So, do you think that some of these FinTechs are kind of non-banks? I mean, would you consider them kind of non-banks within this system? Do you think they’ll be able to do this stuff faster? And I don’t mean this as a negative to banks. Banks are highly regulated. Do you think some of these FinTechs will be able to do some of this stuff faster?

 

DM: It depends on which way you look at it. Because here’s the deal: so when we talk about banking and then we talked about FI FinTech and then FinTech. So a bank is a chartered institution and FI FinTech is a technology arm of that like online banking, mobile banking. A FinTech is something that looks like a bank, talks like a bank, but it doesn’t have a charter. It’s not really a bank. So they have to partner with an existing bank to charter. So there’s a bank behind every FinTech company. So when you think of Chime and companies like that, there’s an actual bank behind that company that’s doing the regulatory side of this to protect consumers.

 

TN: You guys track a lot of data around banking and real estate and consumer stuff and industry stuff. Are you seeing any data that’s really talking about or raising your worries about the velocity of money about how quickly people are spending? Are you seeing that data? If it’s worrying you, when does that worry end for you? Do you see us going back in to say a quasi-normal situation within the next two months or something?

 

DM: Predicting the future I’ve never really been a big proponent of. That’s your business. But for us, what we look at are key components.

 

One way to measure things right now is to look at a mortgage note on a 15 or a 30. What is the spread between, what we would call in the old days, prime and what is the asking rate on that loan So you’re generally looking at above 3 percent. And as long as you’re looking at that, that’s a strong indication that there’s a lot of refis going on right now. And so the spread is there. That’s an adequate spread for banks to make money. There’s a huge volume of it going on. And as long as we see that volume and people continue to go to the bank, cash their checks, direct deposit always helps.

 

When we use our debit cards, when we go out and do the things that we do. Changing our mechanism of spending money whether it’s through Amazon as opposed to going through the mall doesn’t change the fact that you’re still spending money. Those are all positive things.

 

But I think the one thing we want to keep an eye on is the volume of lending. Everyone in a situation like this is going to have a tendency to kind of climb up a little bit. And, as long as that continues to flow, and one of the primary things that I’d be looking at is refis and other lending types of loan, etc.

 

TN: Are there any specific indicators you’re looking at on the commercial side to see if people are climbing up?

 

DM: I don’t really see anything from that perspective. I don’t think people are running out there right now at a time like this. It’s fairly obvious. You wouldn’t want to run out and start a new construction project or something like that. Those are gonna have an impact. There’s no way around it, but there again that’s what stimulus is there to offset.

 

Right now, I would say we’ve got a very healthy banking system. We’re coming out of a very healthy economy and so what’s our time frame of a bounce-back is it going to be a v-bottom or is it going to be spread out? I think it’ll be a little more spread out than a V-bottom and I think they’ll probably be multiple cycles of this that go on to some degree.

 

But starting from a really healthy position in our banking system and in our economy, this will pass. And when it does, here’s the thing I think is so interesting, unprecedented levels of stimulus and, the old saying you don’t fight the Fed, right? So does the market go up and we have a stimulated economy? Of course it does. And with this level of pent-up demand and stimulus, will there be a bounce back? Yeah, there’ll be a bounce back. The question is how huge will it be and how fast?

 

TN: That’s great Dave. It’s a huge source of optimism. Thank you so much for that and I really appreciate that you’ve taken the time to join us today. So really appreciate your time and and thanks very much for, for all that you’ve shared with us today. I really appreciate it.

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COVID-19 effects on the US Economy

As the COVID-19 effects hit in the US, more than 3 million Americans lost their jobs last week. Reports also show a sluggish growth on personal consumption. The Fed Chairman says the US may already be in recession. We are joined by Tony Nash, CEO and Founder of Complete Intelligence, from Houston, Texas.

 

CNA: We’ve got this incredible amount of stimulus in the system, and the market seems loving it. The fundamentals of COVID-19 are getting worse, but the markets seem to be moving another direction. Is there a disconnect?

 

TN: I don’t think there is. I think there are two things. First, people want better information. With the testing and other things. Not all tests are created equally. We are not told the denominator of the tests. I’m not an expert, but there are some issues around that not all countries’ numbers are created equally. But the 2 trillion dollar stimulus, it’s not possible that that’s the extent of the stimulus that the US government is going to issue.

 

This is a government-induced recession, globally. A recession is typically an economic failure, a financial failure. What has happened is that governments have effectively turned down the economy like putting their economies in a coma. So there’s nothing that companies can do to avoid this. This is the responsibility of every government that puts strict measures in place and it’s their responsibility to make sure that their economies are back up.

 

CNA: Are you concerned about the cost to cushion the fall of COVID-19 effects? Remember the 2008 financial crises and how much money it took back then—hundreds and billions? We are now talking about trillions here. When will we able to see the kind of recovery that we saw in the past 10 years once we’re over COVID-19?

 

TN: I do believe we’ll see that recovery. I believe this is sufficiently different. It was not the market’s fault. This was the investor market, investor banks back in 2008, 2009. This is the government today. So it’s the government’s responsibility to fix what they did. I understand they’re responding to COVID-19 and its effects, but they’re the ones to put the measures in place. They’re the ones to handcuff managers, CEOs, and executive teams. So it’s the government’s responsibility to help companies start back up.

 

CNA: On that note, Donald Trump wants the American workforce to get back to their jobs as everybody wants to work. I don’t doubt that. Do you agree with that? Is that the solution, the elixir to the problem here?

 

TN: I do believe that. I’m actually more worried about the social issues associated with jobless dislocation than really the COVID-19 effects. Not that I don’t care. I want everyone to take measures. But the social dislocation of people in their prime working age. Being laid off. We have 3 million of them as reported today. These are people in their prime. They’re earning and they’re losing their jobs. We’re gonna see a lot of problems. And so, depression, suicide, all sorts of things.

 

My fear is that those things start to manifest in the next few weeks. So the US has to get back to work. Americans have to get back to work. Otherwise, people will be short on their bills and they’ll feel incredibly stressed.

 

CNA: How bad do you think the economic data is going to get? Now that we got the 3.3 million jobless claims out of the United States? Is this just going to continue to get worse and worse down the pipeline here?

 

TN: Oh yeah. I think it will get worse until probably the third week of April or maybe the 4th week of April. We’ll continue to see this over the next month until the hump. Once we get over the hump, we’ll see, once the fiscal stimulus starts to take place, which is the big difference this time.

 

We’re seeing a lot of fiscal stimulus. That’s the difference. It’s not just the Fed printing dollars, of course, that’s happening. But we’re seeing fiscal stimulus going straight to end consumers. That’s very important.

 

CNA: What can we learn from China’s response in this situation? It seems things are returning back to normal in China with Hubei province opening up, Wuhan in 2 weeks, traffic jams in Beijing. Can the US look forward to that extrapolation? What’s happening in China, coz I mean the capital markets in China have made a decent recovery as well.

 

TN: I think the US is going to come back pretty aggressively in say the last week of April or early May. I don’t see that the way the US is handling it is similar to China, given the civil liberties that Americans have, there’s absolutely no way that that would work in America.

 

We have a thing called the 4th Amendment in the US that allows people to assemble and leave their houses. So welding people in their apartments wouldn’t work here, and so the US had to take other measures. And I actually think it’s being fairly effective. The case count in the US looks like it’s high, but I’m not convinced that we’re seeing full reporting from any other countries.

 

CNA: Thanks so much, great to chat with you. Stay safe there in Houston, Texas.

 

 

Watch the interview on Channel News Asia’s Asia First. 

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[Global Insight] Why are stocks, oil prices continuing to crash?

 

Arirang News notes:

 

Oil prices have fallen sharply for four consecutive weeks now. Slumping by more than 60 percent since the turn of 2020. As the coronavirus pandemic continues to severely disrupt business, travel and daily life, demand for crude has been plunging, and major producers like Russia and Saudi Arabia haven’t helped the situation by launching an intense price war.

 

This is stirring even more volatility in global stock markets as the world economy reels from the coronavirus pandemic. It’s a time of uncertainty but to provide us with a better sense of what might lie ahead, we’re joined by Dr. Kang Wu, Head of Analytics, Asia at S&P Global Platts, and Tony Nash, CEO and Founder of Complete Intelligence.

 

Let’s first talk about the losses seen on Wall Street on Monday. Dr. Wu, starting with you: U.S. stocks ended in the red, after a two trillion dollar coronavirus support package failed to pass the Senate for the second time. And stocks have been extremely volatile in recent weeks despite the Federal Reserve having cut its interest rates twice this month and rolling out other never-seen-before measures. Why have these moves failed to reassure investors and are you expecting markets to fall even further?

 

This is a very volatile time and overall the demand globally on commodities and on the economy is very weak. So it’s a panicking situation for many economies. It really is up to the individual governments to stimulate the economy and global organizations. I do see that the current downward pressure on the economy and the commodity market will continue until we have a solution. However, the government of the US and other countries and the Fed could help the situation.

 

 

Oil prices have also been getting battered day after day, due to lower demand and this oil price war between Saudi Arabia and Russia. Mr. Nash, Moscow started it by refusing to agree to cut its oil production. It’s a dangerous game of chicken so what are they aiming to gain from this brinkmanship?

 

I think they’re just aiming for more say in the trajectory for crude. This is really a capacity game. Russia doesn’t have the additional capacity available really to go to up against Saudi Arabia. Saudi Arabia has a lot of capacity available. So if Saudi Arabia wants, they can continue producing more volume. The problem is neither government can afford to produce at these rates. They need crude prices about $20 higher than they are right now. So we don’t see this as viable for either government for much longer.

 

 

Dr. Wu, you were in charge of research in global energy markets in Riyadh. What do you think MPS’s strategy is. Can either country afford this war and who do you think will blink first?

 

I agree that there is an issue with the physical budget for Saudi Arabia and similarly there is the issue of the budget for Russia. However, in terms of how long we can sustain the current low prices also depends on how they are fiscally and the reserves they have.

 

Saudi Arabia oil is very important. Crown Prince has been trying to very hard to diversify the economy of Saudi Arabia. So currently the overall oil market is in turmoil in a way that they have very few strategies to pursue. One is to preserve the prices and the other one is to preserve the market share or drive out competitors. So it seemed that after three and a half years of trying the price defense, now they are turning to another strategy to drive out the competition in the oil market.

 

 

Dr. Wu: With the impact of COVID-19 on markets and economies around the world, what dangers lurk around the corner if this oil price war rages on for a prolonged period of time? Is it a potential nail in the coffin for many oil companies who were already struggling to turn a profit when oil was 40 dollars a barrel, let alone 20 dollars?

 

Many companies, many players will get hurt. Other OPEC producers and exporters, smaller ones other than Russia, which is an OPEC and a Saudi Arabia, they will get hurt, and globally, US shale oil producers and Canadian heavy oil sands project operators, if the low oil price continues. Once you know that the global oil storage is running to the limit, then there’s no choice. Some have to give up. Some have to reduce production. And that will start from the high oil producers around the world.

 

 

Mr. Nash: Some say the motivation behind this price war is to hurt U.S. shale gas producers? Do you agree and will it work? Can the US Shale industry complex survive a prolonged stretch with oil basically being given away? How should the U.S. government react to this?

 

In 2015, we saw OPEC really take that aggressive stance against shale producers. I think it failed because US authorities tried to, and very effectively, extended credit to shale producers. I think this time that those same or even more aggressive instruments will be put in place to defend shale producers.

 

That’s not to say everyone is going to be healthy. That’s not to say there won’t be consolidation in shale. It’s also not to say there won’t be kind of closed downs in places that are really expensive like Colorado and other places to produce. But I think in general, the aim is to ensure that the volume of shale production in the US stays relatively consistent and that the US can continue to be a net producer of crude and I think that’s really what the US is focused on.

 

So I see this as a Saudi-Russia issue, and perhaps a Saudi-Iran issue as much as it is a kind of Saudi-Russia-Shale issue.

 

 

As an aftermath of this, what do you think the long-term impact would be on oil markets on all companies across the world?

 

Crude companies have to become much more efficient. There’s a lot of automation, there’s a lot of other things that can happen within oil companies. There’s a difference between national oil companies and independent oil companies. so the national oil companies are typically pretty inefficient, and they’ll probably stay that way. The independent oil companies, really the private sector ones, will have to get even more competitive, which there’s plenty of room for them to get competitive and I think they’ll be the healthier ones in the long run.

 

 

Dr. Wu: OPEC’s current production cut deal expires at the end of the month. Do you see prices dropping even further after that? (and if so, how would it affect broader financial markets?)

 

Yes, I do. At the end of the month, I do not see that Russia and Saudi Arabia will come back to the negotiation table very soon. Eventually, they might. But not in a very short time. So April is probably a pretty challenging month for the oil market as the demand continued to drop due to the pandemic of the Coronavirus and oil production. Not only the price formulas by Saudi Arabia, but physical supply of OPEC, particularly Saudi Arabia UAE will increase. That will put a lot of pressure on non-OPEC producers, which are more dominated by independent in North America. Of course also national oil companies as well. At the end of the day, the market needs to be balanced. So Asian players included can buy more oil but up to the limit of the storage, up to the limit of the current state of demand, which is very, very weak.

 

What do you think, Mr. Nash? Do you think there’ll be another oil cut, though?

 

It’s possible. What we’re seeing is we think the last half of April we’ll actually see prices return. We think toward the end of April, we’ll start to see prices back in the 40s. So things may get slightly worse in the short term, and anything is possible. But we know within the 40s, crude prices are depressed anyway. We’ve started to see Asia really come back online post-Corona and we’ll see that kind of move westward as well. So that consumption capacity as that comes back online, that will put pressure on prices.

 

The pressure between the Saudi government and the Russian government, their fiscal revenues, there will be serious pressure there. And you can bet there’s probably pressure from the US government on the Saudis and the Russians to resolve this. So I think that pressure will only intensify over the next two weeks. And we’ll see some resolution say mid-April or third week of April.

 

 

Thank you very much for joining the program today Dr. Kang Wu, Head of Analytics, Asia at S&P Global Platts, and Tony Nash, CEO and Founder of Complete Intelligence.

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QuickHit: Status of Global Supply Chain in Time of Coronavirus

In this week’s QuickHit episode, Tony Nash speaks with George Booth, the President of Secure Global Logistics. SGL is a complete logistics company with global and domestic services. We dig deeper into the status of global supply chains within this era of Coronavirus or COVID-19 and learn how companies move things across the globe, and what that is looking like right now.

 

Last week’s Quick Hit episode was about how SMEs are affected by the global pandemic and pieces of advice from an expert on the best course of action. Watch it here.

 

The views and opinions expressed in this QuickHit episode are those of the guests and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of Complete Intelligence. Any content provided by our guests are of their opinion and are not intended to malign any political party, religion, ethnic group, club, organization, company, individual or anyone or anything.

 

Show Notes:

 

TN: Hi, this is Tony Nash with Complete Intelligence. This is our weekly Quick Hit that we publish each week. We’ve got George Booth, President of Secure Global Logistics in Houston, Texas.

 

We’re really interested to understand George’s view on the impact of Coronavirus on global logistics, supply chains, and trade. And what the impact is on the volume, timing and magnitude of trade. George, first could you tell us just a real quick overview of SGL? Then let’s get into some of the topics.

 

GB: Yes, good morning, Tony. Good to be here. The SGL is a complete logistics company. We do a full suite of global and domestic logistics, including import, customs brokerage, exports by air and sea and domestic by air and road. We also do 3PL logistics, so full warehousing, packing and getting ready for export.

 

TN: Perfect. That’s great George. Thanks very much. And I really appreciate you taking the time to talk. I know there’s a lot going on as shippers and the other folks try to figure out how to get goods to destination with the disruption of the supply chain. Can you help us understand, what are you seeing in terms of volumes for your clients?

 

GB: Yeah. Well, interestingly, the volumes haven’t dropped off yet. We would expect that to happen almost immediately. Shut down hasn’t started to happen here. It hasn’t happened yet. I think we’ve been slightly helped with a buffer by China coming back online.

 

In January and February, we took a real hit from our customers that import from China. That’s when they just shut down and factories were closed. We saw nothing coming in, but that’s now picking back up.

 

For example, we have a customer who does a monthly freight out of China. That hadn’t happened in like two months, and this week we’re moving 21 ton of freight out of China. And he said, “Get it here fast.” They want to get the product on the market and sell it.

 

We haven’t seen a drop off yet. We’re also seeing a big spike in freight this past week, and even yesterday, as a lot of clients are preparing for a shutdown. So they’re trying to get that product moving and maybe converting from sea freight, ocean freight to air freight to get it moving and to get to the destination before the shutdown happens.

 

TN: OK. So volume has been pretty consistent. What about, you know, as we’ve seen, say, the crude price, because I understand some of your clients are big gas firms.  With the crude price declining as it happens, what impact has that had on shipping rates? And what is the typical relationship of crude price and shipping rates?

 

GB: Well, this is really interesting. I’ve been in the shipping industry for all of my career of about 25 years. And this is the first time we’re not seeing a direct correlation between lower oil price and low freight rates.

 

That’s been really challenging, our clients are suffering from a lower price, but we have had to present them with much higher rates from the carriers and particularly air freight.

 

The air freight in the past, when the oil price was down, the freight rates go down with it. And then when they go up, you see a big spike included fuel surcharges. But because of capacity issues, air freight has now become almost the highest bidder scenario.

 

Some airlines are selling to the highest bidder. We are seeing freight rates in some cases 10 times what they normally ask. Something would have paid a dollar fifty per kilo in the past, we’re now seeing going for up fifteen dollars.

 

I’ve seen a lot of lack of flexibility from the air freight carriers, as well. While in the past you might have booked it, and the factory wasn’t quite ready or it wasn’t ready to export. You’d still book it into the next day with no charge for lost slots.

 

If you don’t show up with your freight, they’ve been really clear, which, again, from a supply chain, you can understand, they’re not getting the same return. So they’re making it inflate.

 

I once had an airline say that the best deal for them is that the cabin, first-class cabin is full, economy empty, and the belly full of freight. Now, they don’t do first class. So they’re making all their money on the various freights.

 

TN: Are you seeing sea freight come down or stay the same or what’s happening with sea freights?

 

GB: Well, sea freights have been very interesting as well, because the distribution of liner and equipment, shipping containers, there’s a backlog in China because China hasn’t been moving.

 

A lot of equipment is stuck in China. The past few weeks, we’ve started to see competitive, very competitive sea freight rates coming out of China as China tries to boost the economy, get freight moving. And also as liners are trying to get the equipment back in the right places.

 

Conversely, trying to export from Europe or from the US. We’re seeing much higher rates because there’s a lack of capacity and a real demand for liner and equipment. So that’s proven a challenge. So it depends where your ship has been from and to, based on the allocation and relocation of liner and equipment.

 

TN: Okay. It is interesting from your perspective to see China’s actually back online.  We’re actually seeing the physical goods coming and you’re seeing the volumes come in. I think that’s very interesting.

 

So what is the biggest kind of concern that your clients have right now in terms of logistics and some supply chains? What do you hear from them as their biggest concern?

 

GB: Yeah. I mean, a lot of our clients are tied to oil and gas. They operate as a squeeze-in. And as it squeezes, it comes all the way down. And I always say the fate of logistics is at the end of the food chain.

 

We get the squeeze all the way down. Some of our clients are being asked to take 40 percent reductions in the rates. And now squeezing that back down to all that supply.

 

At times in, well, of course, we want to work with you. But we’re also presented with air freight that is 10 times what used to be. It’s proven very challenging commercially for our customers, and for us to keep those relationships. They want to continue to be a partner at a time when they want us to share the bin with the promise of sharing the prize when it comes back.

 

But the oil and gas industry, as you know, has been depleted since 2015. So we’ve all been sharing the bin for a long time. So there’s not much left in the market for starters being distribution goes.

 

TN: OK. And George, I don’t know if you can answer this question, but how long do you expect this to last? What do you expect, what do your clients expect? Are they expecting this next month or two months or six months or a couple of weeks? How long do you think this will last in the US?

 

GB: Yeah, I think China’s a good indicator of the length of time they needed to end it and start to come out of it. So we have been planning for the same length, 120 days.

 

I mean, based on the president’s comments yesterday, it seems like there’s a real bullish approach to not going into this too long. I don’t know if that’s keeping with health advisory or not. But it seems that America wants to get back to business sooner rather than later.

 

I think we’ll see that big spike as we have this past week and this week as people try and get product moving before very they put it in shutdown. And then we’ll see the wall. And then there’ll be a backlog and people will start and try and get goods moving again.

 

So we were making our plans 90 to 120 days. And we’re hopeful, obviously, that it comes back.

 

But, our industry has also led the charge in health and safety, so we’ve been talking about our safety language for many years, even decades. And this is a time to prove that we care for our people, care for our supply chains and for our communities.

 

And we’re thinking very much the safety of our employees at our every week touch points, literally and figuratively speaking. Even four weeks ago, we had a memo out to our staff saying to be ready to work from home. And that this is coming. And we saw it coming because we were in daily contact with our partners in China and Italy and in Europe. So we could see what was happening there.

 

So, and we’ve been preparing for this. We operate from the cloud. So a lot of our people are operating from home. I’ve got so much scale and staff, and we rehearsed it.

 

TN: Fantastic. George, thanks very much. Thanks for your time. I really appreciate it.

 

If any of the viewers have questions, leave me comments or send us an email at Complete Intelligence. Thanks very much.

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Economic Outlook Conference 2020 in The Woodlands Highlights Local Economy

THE WOODLANDS, TX – “Innovative Solutions in a Diverse Community,” was the theme of the 2020 Economic Outlook Conference. The Woodlands Area Chamber of Commerce organizes the event annually to provide community members with insight as to how the economy is expected to perform each year.

Congressman Kevin Brady started the morning with a national update. He discussed tax reform, job growth in the United States, record low unemployment rates, the need for our country to win the innovation race, as well as factors that are halting our growth.

“The biggest obstacle of growth in America is our workforce,” he said. “Not having the workers we need is already slowing growth right now in America. It is slowing corporate growth, it is slowing small business growth … Nine of ten companies that hire blue-collar workers can’t find the workers they need. We’ve got to solve this problem if we want stronger growth over the next decade for the United States,” he said.

Gil P. Staley, CEO of The Woodlands Area Economic Development Partnership continued the day with a community/regional update. He announced that healthcare is now the largest employment sector in our service area; growing from 24 percent in 2019 to 26 percent in 2020. The second largest employment sector is energy at 22.4 percent, and the third is education at 17.8 percent. Healthcare represents 40 percent of the Top Major Employers, with 10,027 jobs.

The Top Ten Major Employers (Non-Retail) in order are as follows: Conroe Independent School District, Memorial Hermann The Woodlands Medical Center, ExxonMobil, Occidental, CHI St. Luke’s Health – The Woodlands Hospital, Houston Methodist The Woodlands Hospital, Alight Solutions, Lone Star College – Montgomery, Texas Children’s Hospital The Woodlands, and Huntsman Corporation.

Senior Economist at the Houston Branch of the Federal Reserve Bank of Dallas, Jesse Thompson, provided an economy update. His main conclusion: Houston’s economy in 2020 is predicted to be, “positive, modest, but certainly not booming”.

Following Thompson’s presentation, an innovation panel, compiled of four executives, discussed how the latest trends in innovation help businesses solve economic issues. Innovation panelists included: Clint Brinkley, CEO of Your Business Solutions; Ashok Gowda, president and CEO, of Biotex, Inc.; Deanea LeFlore, senior director of corporate and community engagement for The Ion; and Tony Nash, founder and CEO of Complete Intelligence.

The afternoon concluded with a luncheon where keynote speaker, Dr. Renu Khator inspired the audience with her life story. Dr. Khator is Chancellor of University of Houston System and President of University of Houston. Within three years, she was able to establish UofH as a Tier One university.

Between intelligent speakers, and numerous networking opportunities, the Economic Outlook Conference 2020 provided an enlightening and productive experience for all involved.

 

This press release first appeared in Woodlands Online here: https://www.woodlandsonline.com/npps/story.cfm?nppage=65546